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Date: Mon, 23 Jan 2012 08:25:05 +0000 (GMT)
From: Mark Struberg <struberg@yahoo.de>
Reply-To: Mark Struberg <struberg@yahoo.de>
Subject: Re: [DISCUSS] Logging
To: "deltaspike-dev@incubator.apache.org"
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Hi!=0A=0AJust a general observation as someone who took a pretty deep look =
into log4j (1 and 2) and other logger frameworks.=0A=0Ai18n logging is *pie=
p* - it's really not worth it!=0A=0AWe really need to distinguish technical=
 logging from presenting 'messages' to the user. =0A=0ALogging should be fo=
r the log only, and NEVER make it to the face of an end user. And as such, =
only a technician will need to deal with it. =0A=0AI suggest to ONLY log in=
 english, because then it's much easier to look up the problem on the inter=
net.=0A=0AImaging getting a Hungarian log message on our list. Does anybody=
 here know what that text would actually mean? NOPE.=0AAnd also our Hungari=
an friends would also not be able to search for their problems on the inter=
net, because the chance that they find the Hungarian error text is almost n=
ull.=0A=0AAu contraire for always logging in English: it will be easy for u=
s and easy for the guy/gal having the problem to search for a solution.=0A=
=0ASo all the i18n stuff for _logging_ is really unnecessary.=0A=0AOf cours=
e the idea looks generally good for our messaging module. I really liked th=
e CODI messaging module which could create JSF messages on the fly. Your id=
ea with the typesafe approach could fit nicely for that - and it looks easy=
 to provide tool support for creating the resource bundles.=0A=0AThat is al=
so one thing I like to address on the long run: tool support for DeltaSpike=
 resource bundles. =0ACurrently pretty much every Java Resource bundle will=
 =0A=A0a.) pretty quickly run out of sync for the different languages (the =
order must be preserved manually)=0A=A0b.) pretty quickly will contain unus=
ed resource keys.=0A=0AIf we can solve this problem, I'd be more than happy=
.=0A=0ABut again: this is a messaging issue and does NOT affect logging at =
all!=0A=0A=0ALieGrue,=0Astrub=0A=0A=0A=0A----- Original Message -----=0A> F=
rom: Ken Finnigan <ken@kenfinnigan.me>=0A> To: deltaspike-dev@incubator.apa=
che.org=0A> Cc: =0A> Sent: Monday, January 23, 2012 4:22 AM=0A> Subject: [D=
ISCUSS] Logging=0A> =0A> All,=0A> =0A> As we approach a 0.1 release of Delt=
aSpike, congratulations to everyone on=0A> the good work so far, I feel it'=
s a good time to begin discussing how we=0A> want to handle logging within =
DeltaSpike.=A0 I certainly don't expect this=0A> discussion to result in co=
de for 0.1, but the earlier we begin this=0A> discussion, then it increases=
 the likelihood of it being ready for 0.2=0A> =0A> Having been heavily invo=
lved in the logging work for Solder, I know the=0A> pain that can be experi=
enced in not getting it right, and also how long it=0A> can take to get rig=
ht.=0A> =0A> I see that there are several goals that we want for logging in=
 DeltaSpike:=0A> =0A> =A0  1. Make it simple for both extension writers and=
 end users.=A0 If it's too=0A> =A0  difficult to implement, use or even get=
 right, then we'll frustrate and=0A> =A0  alienate developers.=0A> =A0  2. =
It must perform.=A0 We don't want to introduce large overhead to=0A> =A0  l=
ogging.=0A> =A0  3. There should be an option to allow/provide type safe lo=
gging. [1]=0A> =A0  4. An end user should be able to have DeltaSpike log ag=
ainst whichever=0A> =A0  logging library they want to utilize in their appl=
ication.=A0 We can=0A> =A0  certainly support a specific framework as a def=
ault, but it's important =0A> to=0A> =A0  allow a developer to have the sam=
e control over how DeltaSpike is logged as=0A> =A0  their own application.=
=0A> =0A> Thoughts?=0A> =0A> Regards=0A> =0A> Ken Finnigan=0A> =0A> =0A> [1=
] An example of type safe logging, from Solder, is to define an interface=
=0A> such as:=0A> =0A> @MessageLogger=0A> public interface BirdLogger {=0A>=
 =A0 =A0 @Log=0A> =A0 =A0 @Message("Spotted %s Hawks")=0A> =A0 =A0 void log=
HawksSpotted(int number);=0A> =0A> =A0 =A0 @Log=0A> =A0 =A0 @Message("Spott=
ed %s Owls")=0A> =A0 =A0 void logOwlsSpotted(int number);=0A> =0A> =A0 =A0 =
@Log=0A> =A0 =A0 @Message("Spotted %s Bald Eagles")=0A> =A0 =A0 void logBal=
dEaglesSpotted(int number);=0A> }=0A> =0A> and then create properties files=
 for each language that you want to support=0A> for these log messages.=A0 =
For instance, if the interface existed in the=0A> org.deltaspike.logging pa=
ckage, then you would create=0A> org.deltaspike.logging.BirdLogger.i18n_fr.=
properties containing names=0A> matching the methods on the above interface=
, and values representing=0A> localized versions of the String within @Mess=
age.=0A> =0A> Finally, a compile time annotation processor would generate c=
oncrete=0A> classes for each interface and localized version.=A0 In the abo=
ve example you=0A> would end up with BirdLogger.class and BirdLogger_fr.cla=
ss=0A> =0A> To use the logger that was generated, you then simply do someth=
ing like:=0A> =A0 =A0 @Inject=0A> =A0 =A0 private BirdLogger logger;=0A> =
=0A> =A0 =A0 public void generateLogMessage() {=0A> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 logger.=
logBaldEaglesSpotted(2);=0A> =A0 =A0 }=0A>