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From: Brian McCallister <mccallister@forthillcompany.com>
Subject: [OT] RC duration; was Re: API changes in Criteria before Release 1.0
Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2004 11:43:44 -0500
To: "OJB Developers List" <ojb-dev@db.apache.org>

Have we really been in RC for almost a full year?! That isn't good.

-Brian

On Feb 15, 2004, at 11:31 AM, Jakob Braeuchi wrote:

> hi larry,
>
> those methods are deprecated since 11 months between RC1 and RC2.
> this means we'll have to live with them until 1.1.
>
> jakob
>
> Larry Streepy wrote:
>
>> To me, the question boils down to when the methods were deprecated.   
>> If
>> there was a real release in which the methods were deprecated, then  
>> in a
>> subsequent release they can be removed.  Now, exactly how many  
>> releases you
>> wait is a matter of policy and the level of change you expect your  
>> consumers
>> to deal with.
>> I don't know when these methods were deprecated.  If it was part of  
>> the
>> string of RC's, then they should not come out in the final 1.0.  I  
>> don't
>> know the history of OJB, so I don't know if there was an "official"  
>> 0.9 or
>> something that everyone considered a true release of the product.  If  
>> there
>> was such a beast, and the methods were deprecated in that release,  
>> then it
>> would be reasonable to remove them in the 1.0 final release.
>> This may be open source, but people depend on these API's to  
>> implement real
>> products.  Thus, you need to treat OJB with the same level of care and
>> provide a reasonable level of stability in the API.  It's just good  
>> product
>> management.
>> Thanks.
>> Larry.
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Jakob Braeuchi [mailto:jbraeuchi@gmx.ch]
>>> Sent: Sunday, February 15, 2004 6:16 AM
>>> To: OJB Developers List
>>> Subject: Re: API changes in Criteria before Release 1.0
>>>
>>> hi brian, erik,
>>>
>>>
>>> Brian McCallister wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> Anything marked as deprecated in 1.0 should have an expectation of
>>>> removal in 1.1
>>>>
>>>> I agree that 1.01 should not have client API changes.
>>>>
>>>
>>> that's exactly why i wanted to remove it _before_ 1.0.
>>>
>>> jakob
>>>
>>>
>>>> -Brian
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Feb 13, 2004, at 7:39 PM, Erik Forkalsrud wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> I don't consider myself an OJB developer, so feel free to ignore
>>>>> this,  but I must say that I disagree with the reasoning here.
>>>>>
>>>>> If the 1.0 release is going to mean anything at all, I would expect
>>>>> it  to mean API stability, so all API changes like this should go  
>>>>> in
>>>>> before 1.0 final, or wait until 2.0.  If I build an application  
>>>>> that
>>>>> uses OJB 1.0, any user of that application shouldn't need to worry
>>>>> about upgrading to OJB 1.0.1 or 1.1, to take advantage of bugfixes  
>>>>> or
>>>>> performance improvements.  But if my application uses a method that
>>>>> is  in 1.0, and that method has disappeared in 1.1, the user ends  
>>>>> up
>>>>> with  a broken system.  Such breakage should only happen at major
>>>>> version  upgrades.  0.99 -> 1.0 is major, but 1.0 -> 1.0.1 is not.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Erik Forkalsrud
>>>>> erik@cj.com
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Armin Waibel wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Brian McCallister wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -1
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> RC stage is too late to remove methods. We can get rid of them  
>>>>>>> with
>>>>>>> 1.1 or even 1.0.1 if we are in a big hurry, though 1.0.1 should
>>>>>>> only  be a bug fix release
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> hmm (maybe I was too enthusiastic ;-)), I revise my vote, if
>>>>>> deprecated methods works well I agree with Brian.
>>>>>> Armin
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -Brian
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Feb 13, 2004, at 12:12 PM, Armin Waibel wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Jakob Braeuchi wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> hi all,
>>>>>>>>> Criteria contains some deprecated methods dealing with orderBy
>>>>>>>>> and  groupBy. these methods have been moved to query a long  
>>>>>>>>> time
>>>
>>> ago.
>>>
>>>>>>>>> what about deleting those methods _before_ releasing 1.0 ?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> +1, kick the old stuff out ;-)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Armin
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> jakob
>>>>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------- 
>>>>>>>>> ----
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>>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
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>>>>
>>>>
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