Return-Path: Delivered-To: apmail-db-derby-dev-archive@www.apache.org Received: (qmail 59841 invoked from network); 3 Apr 2006 18:24:06 -0000 Received: from hermes.apache.org (HELO mail.apache.org) (209.237.227.199) by minotaur.apache.org with SMTP; 3 Apr 2006 18:24:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 1451 invoked by uid 500); 3 Apr 2006 18:23:57 -0000 Delivered-To: apmail-db-derby-dev-archive@db.apache.org Received: (qmail 1392 invoked by uid 500); 3 Apr 2006 18:23:57 -0000 Mailing-List: contact derby-dev-help@db.apache.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Post: List-Id: Reply-To: Delivered-To: mailing list derby-dev@db.apache.org Received: (qmail 1366 invoked by uid 99); 3 Apr 2006 18:23:57 -0000 Received: from asf.osuosl.org (HELO asf.osuosl.org) (140.211.166.49) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Mon, 03 Apr 2006 11:23:57 -0700 X-ASF-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=10.0 tests=UNPARSEABLE_RELAY X-Spam-Check-By: apache.org Received-SPF: pass (asf.osuosl.org: local policy) Received: from [192.18.98.36] (HELO brmea-mail-4.sun.com) (192.18.98.36) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Mon, 03 Apr 2006 11:23:56 -0700 Received: from phys-mpk-2 ([129.146.11.82]) by brmea-mail-4.sun.com (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id k33INauf017587 for ; Mon, 3 Apr 2006 12:23:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: from conversion-daemon.mpk-mail1.sfbay.sun.com by mpk-mail1.sfbay.sun.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.24 (built Dec 19 2003)) id <0IX500F01S34NM@mpk-mail1.sfbay.sun.com> (original mail from David.Vancouvering@Sun.COM) for derby-dev@db.apache.org; Mon, 03 Apr 2006 11:23:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [129.150.20.211] (vpn-129-150-20-211.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.150.20.211]) by mpk-mail1.sfbay.sun.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.24 (built Dec 19 2003)) with ESMTP id <0IX5006V1SF7WJ@mpk-mail1.sfbay.sun.com> for derby-dev@db.apache.org; Mon, 03 Apr 2006 11:23:31 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 03 Apr 2006 11:23:32 -0700 From: "David W. Van Couvering" Subject: Re: Should we vote on it? (was Re: Discussion (in preparation for a vote) on interface stability table) In-reply-to: <443112ED.7030802@sun.com> To: derby-dev@db.apache.org Message-id: <44316824.8030702@sun.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Accept-Language: en-us, en User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Windows/20050923) References: <4429C948.1050606@sun.com> <442C4E76.1090504@sun.com> <442C7365.7090709@sun.com> <442C7E65.6020805@sun.com> <442D6092.8020907@sun.com> <442D6665.8040703@apache.org> <442D6F3E.2030709@sun.com> <442D805B.4080207@sun.com> <442D833A.7060309@apache.org> <443112ED.7030802@sun.com> X-Virus-Checked: Checked by ClamAV on apache.org X-Spam-Rating: minotaur.apache.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N I think this is a good approach. Having the project open source solves some of these nasty "bug-compatibility" issues that can occur with closed-source projects with Big Customers. I'll try to add something to this effect in the Wiki page, although it may already be covered in the Exceptions section. David Oystein Grovlen - Sun Norway wrote: > Daniel John Debrunner wrote: > >> Remember this is open-source, there are no customers or "important >> customers", only users and developers. >> >> If a user doesn't like the solution they have at least two options: >> >> - get involved in the Derby developer community >> - patch the source >> >> I prefer the first. > > > Good point, Dan. > > Users of Derby has several options when a new release break their > application: > - Fix their application > - Use the old release (i.e., not upgrade) > - Pay someone (e.g. Sun or IBM) to fix their problem. > - Get involved in the Derby community and suggest a fix to their > problem. > - Patch the source by reverting the fix that causes problem for them. > > I am pretty sure that there will case where it is NOT worth the extra > effort by the community to ensure that a specific user is able to upgrade. > > I also think it is a violation of the Derby charter to NOT fix bugs or > correct sql-states for compatibility reasons. The Derby charter states > that Derby is standard compliant. If there are cases where it does not > comply to the standard, we have the obligation to fix that. >