believe me i know the feeling. I am not quite sure why the methods below are not mentioned for the update and insert section. I will cover this with the EG and discuss possibly clarifying the other wording u suggested i think that covers it yes? Daniel John Debrunner wrote: > Lance J. Andersen wrote: > > >> maybe i am blind today, but i only see the wording in 14.2.4.2 not >> 14.2.4.3 WRT othersXXXAreVisible method that u refer to below >> > > Sorry my mistake, looked at so many things this morning. > > Maybe the issue is 14.2.4.3 does not refer other inserts are visible. > > Dan. > > >