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From Jeff Levitt <jlev...@mutagen.net>
Subject Re: Derby documentation in XML DITA
Date Mon, 06 Dec 2004 18:36:36 GMT

--- scott hutinger <s-hutinger@wiu.edu> wrote:

> sissonj@insession.com wrote:
> 
> >scott hutinger <s-hutinger@wiu.edu> wrote on
> 06/12/2004 05:21:24 PM:
> >
> >  
> >
> >>sissonj@insession.com wrote:
> >>
> >>    
> >>
> >>>scott hutinger <s-hutinger@wiu.edu> wrote on
> 06/12/2004 11:38:59 AM:
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>      
> >>>
> >>>>I haven't followed that entire thread, nor can I
> find that thread 
> >>>>currently.  But, a log plugin; which I think?
> followes which files 
> >>>>        
> >>>>
> >have 
> >  
> >
> >>>>changed, has been developed using
> java.util.logging.  I think it 
> >>>>        
> >>>>
> >allows 
> >  
> >
> >>>>forrest to know which files have changed but I
> think it runs on a 
> >>>>dynamic site, and I am uncertain if the loging
> plugin is hooked into 
> >>>>forrest for this yet.
> >>>>
> >>>>I will keep my eyes on that and research it a
> bit.
> >>>>
> >>>>Also, I am uncertain about the release date of
> 0.7.  I think Jean has 
> >>>>the docs up to spec for 0.6, which I think is
> needed for 0.7.  Cocoon 
> >>>>had a problem creating some graphic files which
> would create errors in 
> >>>>        
> >>>>
> >
> >  
> >
> >>>>site logs, that was fixed in cocoon, but I don't
> know if forrest 
> >>>>        
> >>>>
> >updated 
> >  
> >
> >>>>        
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>      
> >>>
> >>>>cocoon with 6.0 after the release.  I can look
> into that on monday.
> >>>>
> >>>>scott
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>        
> >>>>
> >>>Refer to the links in the comments of the
> following JIRA issue:
> >>>
> >>>http://nagoya.apache.org/jira/browse/DERBY-79
> >>>
> >>>It would be nice if the JIRA issue is used to
> record progress on the 
> >>>documentation.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>      
> >>>
> >>Thanks for pointing this out.  What did you have
> in mind for the search 
> >>on a pc?  I was wondering if you were thinking of 
> something like the 
> >>adobe extensible metadata platform, or something
> like that?  I really 
> >>haven't looked at pdf search techniques.  I guess
> someone could attach 
> >>derby to pdf files somehow :-)
> >>
> >>scott
> >>
> >>    
> >>
> >>>Thanks,
> >>>
> >>>John
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>      
> >>>
> >Hi Scott,
> >
> >I haven't spent any time with cocoon, FOP etc, but
> I have seen other 
> >commercial software products provide a PDF document
> for each of their 
> >manuals and a searchable index that covers all the
> manuals. 
> >
> >I'm not sure if any of the open source PDF file
> generation solutions 
> >provide something like:
>
>http://www.adobe.co.uk/epaper/tips/acr5search/main.html
> >
> >I wasn't trying to suggest that Derby be somehow
> used to search PDF 
> >documentation (not sure if that is what you thought
> I said).. 
> >
> >I would like the ability to search within acrobat
> reader across the 
> >different derby manuals and also have the ability
> to have links from one 
> >manual to the other (as I found I had to refer to
> more than one manual to 
> >perform some Derby tasks).
> >
> >  
> >
> OK, I understand.  I guess I didn't read the issue
> correctly all the way.
> 
> >The following page describes the search
> functionality and it also 
> >mentioned PDF metadata (that you mentioned), so it
> sounds like you might 
> >have given yourself away as the PDF expert :-)
> >
> >  
> >
> Actually, I don't know anything about PDF.  I did
> notice that FOP 
> supports PDF version 1.3.  So I don't think embedded
> XML within the PDF 
> file would work.  It does have Document Level
> Navigation, Destinations, 
> Bookmarks etc.  I did notice in FOP if memory
> problems start to exist, 
> turn off forward references.  But the point I guess
> is, do any other new 
> document formats exist that might be better than
> PDF?  I know we will 
> still output to PDF, but thought some other cool
> document display 
> architecture might exist.   I don't know, as I am
> clueless about such 
> things.  I can look a bit though.
> 
> Anyone know of some other display architecture?
> I'll look more into FOP to see what all it supports.
> 
> thanks,
> scott
> 
>
>http://www.planetpdf.com/enterprise/article.asp?ContentID=6521
> >
> >Cheers,
> >
> >John
> >
> >  

I have an idea that may just solve most if not all of
these issues.  We can use Eclipse.

Check out the Cloudscape version of the help:
http://publib.boulder.ibm.com/infocenter/cldscp10/index.jsp

That entire site was created using Eclipse's help
system package.  To learn more about creating an
Eclipse help system, read about it here:

http://dev.eclipse.org/viewcvs/index.cgi/~checkout~/org.eclipse.platform.doc.isv/reference/misc/help_standalone.html?rev=1.26.2.2

And to deploy a help system on the web:

http://dev.eclipse.org/viewcvs/index.cgi/~checkout~/org.eclipse.platform.doc.isv/reference/misc/help_infocenter.html?rev=1.27.2.2

Long story short, we could host it on the Derby site
using an Apache http server.  I'm not good with the
technical aspects of this, so hopefully someone can
read up on whether the requirements for hosting this
would be allowed by Apache.

But if we can, then all we have to do is use
saxon/cocoon to output xhtml from the DITA (I've
already tested that with success), as well as create
an XML nav tree from the ditamap, also using
saxon/cocoon (again, tested successfully), and then
throw those into an eclipse help system plugin.  The
result would be almost exactly what you see on the
Cloudscape infocenter.  We'd have full advanced
pre-indexed search on all the docs at once, a much
more advanced nav tree, and once we set it up and take
a look at how related links work within the system, we
could modify the dita files to add links between the
docs where needed.  We'd still have PDF docs for those
who want them, of course.

I took the liberty of throwing my tested xhtml and and
xml nav tree into a plugin and testing it locally, and
it looked alright.

Does this sound like it could work?

Jeff

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