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From Karl Heinz Marbaise <>
Subject Re: [jira] [Commented] (RAT-220) JDK version 1.6
Date Sun, 11 Sep 2016 21:03:02 GMT

On 11/09/16 20:59, Javen O'Neal wrote:
> While increasing the minimum supported version does cut out some users who
> are running ancient versions of Java,

To be honest 1.5 Java is out of date how long? Furthermore no security 
updates etc. and no enterprise contracts possible anymore...for JDK 5...

 > it also opens the door to better
> language features.

I think there are many things which can be improved...independent of the 
language features..(for example creating a release easier, make a 
publishing of the site easier etc. only those which I have seen the last 
weeks and where I'm trying to improve. I have not yet taken deeper looks 
into the code etc.)...

 >  If the new features are used, it may be easier for
> potential developers to read the code, contribute, and find bugs that are
> disguised by the more verbose syntax of Java 1.5

If a developer is not able to read Java Code in 1.5 etc. sorry...but 
such old code which plunge some developers...but this is a different 

> You should consider both RAT developers and users when thinking about an
> upgrade.

That's exactly what I'm doing...cause users require more features 
shorter release cycles etc.

For example at the maven project we have the JDK 6 minimum for plugins 
and for Maven version 3.3+ JDK 7

> That said, Sebb is right that you should not increase the version without
> significant thought, as it WILL abandon some users.

Does some of those PMC's tried to get the download statistics from Maven 
Central to see how many users we are talking about?

RAT 0.12 requires Java 1.5 so it's time to say good by to JDK 1.5...

If really someone will find an issue with 0.12 and really needs a bug 
fix we can simply think about creating a branch and produce a 0.12.1 ? 
So I don't see any problem with that...

Apart from that the whole project has not yet reached 1.0.0 state...

 > If the only problem for
> being on different versions is a more complicated compatibility statement
> on your web page,

It's not a problem but shows the inconsistency of the project line...

A simple statement like
RAT, Whiskers and Tentacle use JDK 1.6+ is simple and clear for users...

 > then leave this issue at that. "The Creadur project
> consists of three modules: RAT, Whiskers, and Tentacles.

> RAT requires Java 6+.

RAT requires Java 1.5 and not 1.6 based on the build

> Whiskers and Tentacles requires Java 7+."

Whiskers as well as Tentacles require 1.6 based on the build...

So that was my suggestion to increase the minimum JDK versions which is 
needed to run/build RAT/Tentacles/Whiskers to JDK 6...make at least one 
release and move forward to JDK 7 make another release and move forward 
to JDK 8...This means you have always a base release on which you can 
make bug fix (or if really needed backports) releases for the 
appropriate JDK requirements...

Not to talk about JDK 9 next year (which is not very far in the future)...

Apart from that Tentacles as well as Whiskers need releases at all... 
cause I can't see any release on Maven Central of them...

Tentacles shows 0.1-SNAPSHOT ? (if the bottom line is related 2012?) ?
Whiskers shows 0.1-SNAPSHOT (last updated 2013 ?)

For RAT that 0.12 has been released about three months ago,  but before 
that it has taken 2 years for a release ? I think this is the problem 
not the users...

> On Sep 11, 2016 11:40 AM, "P. Ottlinger" <> wrote:
>> Hi!
>> I tried bringing up this issue more than once, thus I was very happy
>> that somebody else feels the same.
>> In 0.12 we had a contribution that added a Gradle plugin. It failed due
>> to insufficient dependencies with JDK5.

If we had such things that makes it really clear to move forward...

>> Thus there's a need to update .... if we want to stay relevant.
>> If we are happy with some rather old users with Ant and JD5 - ok,

I have my doubts that Ant users user really use JDK 5 apart from that if 
you look at the Ant project they have decided jump directly to JDK 8 
minimum ...1.9.X has been the last which is JDK 5 compatible...

>> but to my mind we should add Gradle support to stay relevant in the ASF
>> sphere.

Which is relevant in other ways as well...apart of the plan to move to 
Kotlin for Gradle 4.X ?

Kind regards
Karl Heinz Marbaise

>> Just my 2 ct
>> Phil
>> Am 11.09.2016 um 14:56 schrieb Sebb (JIRA):
>>>     [
>> atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-
>> tabpanel&focusedCommentId=15481714#comment-15481714 ]
>>> Sebb commented on RAT-220:
>>> --------------------------
>>> +1
>>> We should not change the Java version merely to be consistent with other
>> Creadur projects.
>>> There needs to be a clear end-user benefit to requiring the upgrade.
>>>> JDK version 1.6
>>>> ---------------
>>>>                 Key: RAT-220
>>>>                 URL:
>>>>             Project: Apache Rat
>>>>          Issue Type: Improvement
>>>>            Reporter: Karl Heinz Marbaise
>>>>            Assignee: Jochen Wiedmann
>>>> Currently the RAT project defines as Java compatibility 1.5 but
>> Tentacles defines 1.6 and Whiskers as well 1.6 so it would be a good idea
>> to go to 1.6 as minimum....If someone needs to work with 1.5 toolchain can
>> be used.
>>> --
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