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From Robert Samuel Newson <rnew...@apache.org>
Subject Re: RFC CouchDB Slack channel
Date Sat, 25 Feb 2017 11:16:48 GMT

I'm equivocal on the proposal (and I'm a long-time user of IRC and Slack) so I won't vote
... yet.

Instead of voting, perhaps I can suggest a path forward?

We (PMC) will first evaluate the available privacy controls of the free tier and determine
if an appropriate balance can be struck. I believe message retention policy can be configured
on a per channel basis and that users can delete their own past messages (It's possible to
remove that ability or restrict it).

Joan speaks for many who would participate less, or not at all, if a permanent record of their
words were being maintained. It's just as clear to me that there are many people who never
get involved in CouchDB, or try to but feel excluded by our mailing list or IRC barriers (they
are barriers when the alternative is a website).

Now, a free Slack team has limited search ability to the last 10,000 messages per channel
anyway, so it's a valid question whether that is sufficient even if we were to allow it (_retention_
is unlimited but you have to move to paid tier to get at it).

So, we should be clear what we expect Slack to do for us. It won't replace the mailing lists,
it won't replace any blog posts or documentation, and it won't replace stackoverflow or sites
like it that exist to help users find already published solutions to their problems.

What it can do is make it easier for people to chat about CouchDB in more-or-less realtime.
I'd say it could be do a bit better than that, relative to IRC, through the use of Slack posts
and message pinning, allowing us to prominently display introductory material or howto's,
etc.

I think we at least owe the suggestion a trial period, after the evaluation I mentioned at
the top, but we should be clear what we expect from this effort, and define what a successful
trial would look like.

B.


> On 23 Feb 2017, at 20:53, Jan Lehnardt <jan@apache.org> wrote:
> 
> FWIW, Slack allows per channel disabling of search.
> 
> This would negate the benefit of a more accessible problem/solution 
> archive, but I feel StackOverflow has taken that on anyway, so I
> wouldn’t object to make use of that switch, if it makes this
> proposal more inclusive.
> 
> Best
> Jan
> --
> 
> 
> 
>> On 23 Feb 2017, at 20:56, Joan Touzet <wohali@apache.org> wrote:
>> 
>> I'm -0 on this.
>> 
>> We have a specific history around IRC that is important to retain,
>> specifically the IRC channels have never been logged. I feel strongly
>> about not retaining log history from our discussion area; it gives
>> people the ability to be more free about their discussions without
>> worry about being on the record.
>> 
>> Slack as a host (whether you use IRC or Slack as the chat gateway) 
>> does away with that, at least partially, and I think it will be
>> for the worse.
>> 
>> I will probably drop out of chat if this happens.
>> 
>> -Joan
>> 
>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "David Squier" <dsquier@slitscan.com>
>>> To: "Martin Rudolph" <m.rudolph@email.de>, user@couchdb.apache.org
>>> Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2017 9:56:59 AM
>>> Subject: Re: RFC CouchDB Slack channel
>>> 
>>> Would also love to see this!
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Thu, Feb 23, 2017, at 04:35 AM, Martin Rudolph wrote:
>>> 
>>>> +1 for Slack and btw. I think there is a  http://www.discourse.org/
>>> 
>>>> <http://www.discourse.org/> plugin for slack…
>>> 
>>>> 
>>> 
>>>> Cheers
>>> 
>>>> 
>>> 
>>>> Martin
>>> 
>>>>> Am 23.02.2017 um 13:28 schrieb Dan Santner <dansantner@me.com>:
>>> 
>>>>> 
>>> 
>>>>> I'm in for that!!
>>> 
>>>>> 
>>> 
>>>>>> On Feb 23, 2017, at 1:22 AM, Garren Smith <garren@apache.org>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>> 
>>>>>> Hi All,
>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>> 
>>>>>> I would like create a slack channel for the CouchDB community.
>>>>>> IRC
>>>>>> is often
>>>>>> considered a barrier to entry for people wanting to ask
>>>>>> questions
>>>>>> and learn
>>>>>> about CouchDB. Slack is a lot easier and less intimidating to
>>>>>> get
>>>>>> started
>>>>>> with. When we do this, we would setup a IRC <-> Slack bridge.
>>>>>> So that
>>>>>> people on slack can communicate to people on IRC. So if you
>>>>>> prefer
>>>>>> IRC you
>>>>>> can still use it.
>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>> 
>>>>>> The best success story for this model is the PouchDB community,
>>>>>> they have a
>>>>>> slack channel with a bridge that links the IRC channel. And the
>>>>>> community
>>>>>> has really grown significantly since this has been implemented.
>>>>>> I
>>>>>> know the
>>>>>> Hoodie team also has something like this and it has also worked
>>>>>> well.
>>>>>> 
>>> 
>>>>>> I would like to do the same, with a slack channel with two rooms
>>>>>> that then
>>>>>> have a bridge back to #couchdb and #couchdb-dev.
>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>> 
>>>>>> Would everyone be ok with this? Could we trial it for 3 - 4
>>>>>> months
>>>>>> and see
>>>>>> how it goes?
>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>> 
>>>>>> Cheers
>>> 
>>>>>> Garren
>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>> 
>>>>>> Apache CouchDB PMC
>>> 
>>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
> 
> -- 
> Professional Support for Apache CouchDB:
> https://neighbourhood.ie/couchdb-support/
> 


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