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From Andy Ellicott <aelli...@us.ibm.com>
Subject Re: New motto?
Date Thu, 20 Nov 2014 15:44:36 GMT
I'd avoid tying the motto to a specific app architecture/type? It runs the 
risk of becoming stale IMHO.
e.g., I think I read somewhere that mobile development has eclipsed (or 
soon will eclipse) web development.



Andy Ellicott
VP Marketing
Cloudant.com, an IBM company
200 State Street
Boston, MA  02109
(m) +1 603 205 2804




From:   Alexander Shorin <kxepal@gmail.com>
To:     "marketing@couchdb.apache.org" <marketing@couchdb.apache.org>
Date:   11/20/2014 10:31 AM
Subject:        Re: New motto?



Database for Web.

--
,,,^..^,,,

On Thu, Nov 20, 2014 at 6:24 PM, Mike Broberg <mbroberg@us.ibm.com> wrote:

> Just some ideas -- if only to kick this thread back up when people have
> returned from Apachecon Europe :P
>
>    - Data that moves
>     (from a short doc that Diana Thayer wrote:
>    http://docs.cloudant.com/guides/moving-clusters.html)
>    - Data, with all the right moves
>    - Set your data in motion
>    - The freedom to move
>     (a basic human right:
>    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_rights#Freedom_of_movement)
>    - Data that moves. Data that's freed.
>    - Your data, wherever you need it
>
>
> Maybe they're not inspiring enough, lol. Digging all y'all's ideas. 
--Mike
> --
> Mike Broberg | IBM Cloudant | 200 State Street, Boston, MA 02109 |
> mbroberg@us.ibm.com | (617) 299-1409 Google Voice
> --
>
> [image: Inactive hide details for Noah Slater ---11/07/2014 02:51:33
> PM---Again: WHY are we all building this db with a sync protocol?]Noah
> Slater ---11/07/2014 02:51:33 PM---Again: WHY are we all building this 
db
> with a sync protocol? What's the problem we're trying to solv
>
> From: Noah Slater <nslater@apache.org>
> To: Noah Slater <nslater@apache.org>
> Cc: "marketing@couchdb.apache.org" <marketing@couchdb.apache.org>
> Date: 11/07/2014 02:51 PM
> Subject: Re: New motto?
> ------------------------------
>
>
>
> Again: WHY are we all building this db with a sync protocol? What's
> the problem we're trying to solve? The answer to that is our marketing
> pitch.
>
> On 7 November 2014 20:50, Noah Slater <nslater@apache.org> wrote:
> > Just to cover some old ground here: but I'd like to stay away from
> > "replicate" or "sync" in our primary messaging.
> >
> > Remember:
> >
> > - Why? -- what's our purpose, our goal, our shared values?
> > - How? -- replicate/sync
> > - What? -- HTTP, JSON, MapReduce, Erlang
> >
> > Our slogan (which we could lead with on our website) should
> > communicate that value. Which is why I'm reaching for something like,
> > we want to liberate your data. How are we going to do that? By
> > building the world's best data store with the world's best sync
> > protocol. And we're gonna do that with HTTP, JSON, MapReduce, Erlang,
> > etc.
> >
> > Do you see how the narrative could flow on the homepage? Imagine each
> > stage as a visibly separate section.
> >
> >
> >
> > On 7 November 2014 18:41, Nick Pavlica <linicks@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> All,
> >>   As with the logo, I fully agree that the motto needs to be changed. 
 I
> >> have never been a fan of the "relax" slogan, and have just tried to
> ignore
> >> it.  As I think about it, I wounder if we really need a motto at all.
> The
> >> really hard thing when selecting a motto for something like CouchDB 
is
> that
> >> can mean something different to everyone.  However, if there is one
> >> strength that CouchDB has as a main differentiator from other 
databases
> is
> >> it's syncing/replication capabilities.
> >>
> >> Regards,
> >> -- Nick Pavlica
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On Fri Nov 07 2014 at 9:58:26 AM Joan Touzet <wohali@apache.org> 
wrote:
> >>
> >>> FYI I recommend reading:
> >>>
> >>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raised_fist
> >>>
> >>> for a history of the political implications of that logo.
> >>>
> >>> As to Alex's comment, I like the riff on the French national motto
> >>> of freedom, equality and brotherhood (Liberté, Égalité, Fraternité).
> >>> Worth experimenting a bit more there.
> >>>
> >>> -Joan
> >>>
> >>> ----- Original Message -----
> >>> From: "Alexander Shorin" <kxepal@gmail.com>
> >>> To: marketing@couchdb.apache.org
> >>> Cc: "Joan Touzet" <wohali@apache.org>, "Sean Barclay" <
> sean@cloudant.com>
> >>> Sent: Friday, November 7, 2014 11:50:11 AM
> >>> Subject: Re: New motto?
> >>>
> >>> I think "Liberate" is good one for some Open Data project or toolset
> >>> to work on it, but not for CouchDB which is a database in the first
> >>> place. As for me, my first association with "liberate" was "libre ->
> >>> libreoffice -> wtf", may be because this is rare word for me.  If we
> >>> want (do we?) to focus on replication / data sync everywhere feature
> >>> then the one thing comes to my mind. If anyone still remember this
> >>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E661isduPy8 there was one consonant 
to
> >>> "liberate" word - "replicate". I think replicate more clear and
> >>> explicitly defines the idea of "free to share your data, free to 
sync
> >>> it with whatever they want".
> >>>
> >>> "CouchDB. Replicate." or even "CouchDB. Liberate. Replicate." (yo).
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> ,,,^..^,,,
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Fri, Nov 7, 2014 at 6:56 PM, Noah Slater <nslater@apache.org>
> wrote:
> >>> > Wow, yeah.
> >>> >
> >>> > What do others thing about using this word? "Liberate"? I think it
> has
> >>> > the right mixture of connotations and meanings
> >>> >
> >>> > On 5 November 2014 23:50, Joan Touzet <wohali@apache.org> wrote:
> >>> >> Worth mentioning that Google has the Data Liberation Front team.
> >>> >>
> >>> >> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google_Data_Liberation_Front
> >>> >>
> >>> >> Interesting (and rather provocative!) logo there.
> >>> >>
> >>> >> -Joan
> >>> >>
> >>> >> ----- Original Message -----
> >>> >> From: "Noah Slater" <nslater@apache.org>
> >>> >> To: marketing@couchdb.apache.org, "Javier Candeira" <
> >>> javier@candeira.com>
> >>> >> Sent: Wednesday, November 5, 2014 12:52:05 PM
> >>> >> Subject: Re: New motto?
> >>> >>
> >>> >> So, I just mentioned on dev@, but one of the angles I was 
thinking
> >>> about was:
> >>> >>
> >>> >> - Liberate your data
> >>> >> - Free your data
> >>> >>
> >>> >> Perhaps with "The database that..." before either.
> >>> >>
> >>> >> I think this "liberate" idea taps intot the core of what I think

our
> >>> >> "why?" is. We all seem to have the shared goal of wanting to help
> >>> >> people liberate their data, in terms of being able to move it
> wherever
> >>> >> they want, work on it how they want. Our sync/replication is 
really
> >>> >> only the implementation ("how?") of that goal.
> >>> >>
> >>> >> "Liberate" as a word, and the associations that go with it, also
> taps
> >>> >> into a growing movement of indie developers who are trying to 
move
> >>> >> away from closed data silos and corporate multinationals being
in
> >>> >> control of massive amounts of user data.
> >>> >>
> >>> >> It echoes things like Unhoasted, OfflineFirst, POSSE and PESOS.
> >>> >>
> >>> >>
> >>> >> On 1 November 2014 03:24, Javier Candeira <javier@candeira.com>
> wrote:
> >>> >>> Just brrainstorming, I think the "sync" is the biggest selling
> point
> >>> >>> of CouchDB. The fact that it doesn't lose data is obviously
good
> >>> >>> (cough cough MongoDB cough), but you can hardly advertise "we

don't
> >>> >>> lose your data" in your slogan, that should be a given. You

don't
> >>> >>> advertise youghourt as "0% cyanide" either.
> >>> >>>
> >>> >>> Another strong point is the ecosystem, with TouchDB/Couchbase
> >>> >>> Lite/PouchDB leading the charge.
> >>> >>>
> >>> >>> So I would like to see a slogan along the lines that express
the
> >>> >>> concept of "A database that gets the web, mobile and sync"
(not 
a
> >>> >>> proposal, just a suggestionf or a message.
> >>> >>>
> >>> >>> Or, now in the terrain of slogans, mirroring the famous Dropbox

"A
> >>> >>> Folder. On several computers. That syncs", we could say...
> >>> >>>
> >>> >>> "Your data, on the web and on your device, always in sync."
> >>> >>>
> >>> >>> Though that seems too specific, and getting a bit into Hoodie
> >>> territory.
> >>> >>>
> >>> >>> "CouchDB syncs your data to wherever you need to use it". Hmm,

it's
> >>> >>> more than just sync.
> >>> >>>
> >>> >>> As I said above, this is just an idea dump, inspired by Noah's
> great
> >>> >>> reframing of the problem.
> >>> >>>
> >>> >>> J
> >>> >>>
> >>> >>>
> >>> >>> On Fri, Oct 31, 2014 at 9:44 PM, Jan Lehnardt <jan@apache.org>
> wrote:
> >>> >>>> Thanks Noah!
> >>> >>>>
> >>> >>>> this is where we need to be heading.
> >>> >>>>
> >>> >>>> As related inspiration, see these storytelling rules by
Pixar.
> Not all
> >>> >>>> apply to what we want to do, but pretend CouchDB is a character
> and we
> >>> >>>> want to tell its story: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/
> >>> 2012/07/30/pixar-storytelling_n_1718854.html
> >>> >>>>
> >>> >>>> Best
> >>> >>>> Jan
> >>> >>>> --
> >>> >>>>
> >>> >>>>
> >>> >>>>> On 30 Oct 2014, at 21:16 , Noah Slater <nslater@apache.org>
> wrote:
> >>> >>>>>
> >>> >>>>> Okay, so a while ago we had this discussion about what

CouchDB's
> >>> "why"
> >>> >>>>> was. i.e. What's our purpose.
> >>> >>>>>
> >>> >>>>> There are three questions we can answer, at various
points in 
our
> >>> >>>>> marketing material:
> >>> >>>>>
> >>> >>>>> Why? - What's our shared goal?
> >>> >>>>> How? - How are we working towards it?
> >>> >>>>> What? - What are the particulars of that approach.
> >>> >>>>>
> >>> >>>>> Most projects get this the wrong way round. In fact,
we have
> done. We
> >>> >>>>> tell you about JSON and HTTP and whatever up front.
That's the
> what.
> >>> >>>>> It's not interesting.
> >>> >>>>>
> >>> >>>>> We've had suggestions to use the motto "The database
that
> >>> >>>>> replicates/syncs". That's better. But this is the how.
We're
> telling
> >>> >>>>> you how we're working towards our shared goal. Still
no 
explicit
> >>> goal.
> >>> >>>>>
> >>> >>>>> Now. You look at Apple, and their motto was "think
different".
> It was
> >>> >>>>> always about challenging the status quo and putting
the user
> first.
> >>> >>>>> They just happened to be doing that by building a computer.

(Now
> a
> >>> >>>>> phone, a watch, etc, etc...)
> >>> >>>>>
> >>> >>>>> The thing about stating your values up front is that
you 
attract
> >>> >>>>> people with the same values. They "believe" in you
and what
> you're
> >>> >>>>> doing in a very emotional way.
> >>> >>>>>
> >>> >>>>> Compare this to Dell. You know anybody who's passionate
about
> Dell?
> >>> >>>>> "Hey, we build powerful computers. Buy one." Okay sure,
maybe.
> But
> >>> I'm
> >>> >>>>> not gonna *feel* anything about it.
> >>> >>>>>
> >>> >>>>> So, let's talk about Couch.
> >>> >>>>>
> >>> >>>>> I think that our core value is giving people the power
to do 
what
> >>> they
> >>> >>>>> want with their data. To keep it where ever they want.
To move 
it
> >>> >>>>> where ever they want. And for this to be as easy as
possible.
> >>> >>>>>
> >>> >>>>> Here's a sample formulation
> >>> >>>>>
> >>> >>>>> "We want to put your data in your hands. We're gonna
do that 
by
> >>> >>>>> making it easy to move your anywhere you want. We just
happen 
to
> >>> >>>>> building a database."
> >>> >>>>>
> >>> >>>>> arkos has a great slogan: "Your data, your rules"
> >>> >>>>>
> >>> >>>>> This is where we need to be heading. This isn't about
syncing.
> This
> >>> is
> >>> >>>>> about giving people the power to move their data into
and out 
of
> >>> >>>>> whatever environment, platform, and device they want
to.
> >>> >>>>>
> >>> >>>>> Data autonomy?
> >>> >>>>>
> >>> >>>>> Some other notes:
> >>> >>>>>
> >>> >>>>> Mikeal Rogers said to me that after working with Couch,
he
> started to
> >>> >>>>> take it for granted that getting data back out of a
database
> should
> >>> be
> >>> >>>>> as easy as putting it in. (But apparently this isn't
so) He 
said
> this
> >>> >>>>> was a unique feature of CouchDB.
> >>> >>>>>
> >>> >>>>> Tom Dale once said something about the need to share
and
> distribute
> >>> >>>>> data. No silos. Host individual sites in your own server.

Can't
> >>> >>>>> remember the context, just have it in my notes.
> >>> >>>>>
> >>> >>>>> But this ties into the IndieWebCamp concept of POSSE.
> >>> >>>>>
> >>> >>>>> http://indiewebcamp.com/POSSE
> >>> >>>>>
> >>> >>>>> And also dovetails with OfflineFirst, things like unhosted,

and
> the
> >>> >>>>> growing movement of people who want  local data ownership.
> >>> >>>>>
> >>> >>>>> Also think about the fact that CouchDB is more like
Git than
> >>> >>>>> PostgreSQL. (Thanks Jan, for the analogy.) Decentralised
data,
> >>> >>>>> workflows, syncing, etc. What is this about really?
It's about
> >>> >>>>> enabling decentralised data management. Ties into the
same
> concept.
> >>> >>>>>
> >>> >>>>> Access your data anywhere
> >>> >>>>> Access your data offline
> >>> >>>>> Decentralised data management
> >>> >>>>> Puts you in control of your own data
> >>> >>>>> Local data ownership
> >>> >>>>> Grants you data autonomy
> >>> >>>>> Your data, your rules
> >>> >>>>> Puts your data back in your hands
> >>> >>>>>
> >>> >>>>> ^ Not slogans, just prompts.
> >>> >>>>>
> >>> >>>>> What's our why? If we find that, we'll have our slogan.
> >>> >>>>>
> >>> >>>>>
> >>> >>>>> On 30 October 2014 19:45, Andy Ellicott <andy@cloudant.com>
> wrote:
> >>> >>>>>> I think I read something recently that there's
more mobile 
than
> web
> >>> app development happening these days, so "web" might end up sounding
> >>> outdated.
> >>> >>>>>>
> >>> >>>>>> Random input:
> >>> >>>>>> "Synchronicity" is a word we're using to differentiate
> >>> couchdb-style dbs from others. Feel free to reuse or take 
inspiration
> from
> >>> that...or not :)
> >>> >>>>>>
> >>> >>>>>> Andy
> >>> >>>>>>
> >>> >>>>>> Sent from my iPhone
> >>> >>>>>>
> >>> >>>>>>> On Oct 30, 2014, at 2:35 PM, Alexander Shorin
<
> kxepal@gmail.com>
> >>> wrote:
> >>> >>>>>>>
> >>> >>>>>>> Will repeat myself on IRC:
> >>> >>>>>>>
> >>> >>>>>>> "A database for the web" isn't good one since
PouchDB is
> eventually
> >>> >>>>>>> more "database for the web" than CouchDB now.
> >>> >>>>>>> We need something more fresh, unique and collision
safe as
> like as
> >>> >>>>>>> "Time to relax!" was - it's hard to associate
any other
> database
> >>> with
> >>> >>>>>>> the same motto.
> >>> >>>>>>> --
> >>> >>>>>>> ,,,^..^,,,
> >>> >>>>>>>
> >>> >>>>>>>
> >>> >>>>>>>> On Thu, Oct 30, 2014 at 9:01 PM, Joan Touzet

<joant@lrtw.org>
> >>> wrote:
> >>> >>>>>>>> Coming out of the logo discussion, it seems
2.0 may be the
> >>> >>>>>>>> right time to consider a new motto, replacing
"Time to 
relax."
> >>> >>>>>>>>
> >>> >>>>>>>> PouchDB is "The database that syncs."
> >>> >>>>>>>>
> >>> >>>>>>>> On http://couchdb.apache.org/ today, "A
database for the 
web"
> >>> >>>>>>>> is the most prominent motto, bigger than
"Relax."
> >>> >>>>>>>>
> >>> >>>>>>>> Jan and I will be on stage in 3 weeks in
Budapest to 
present
> >>> >>>>>>>> plans for CouchDB 2.0. I'd love to make
an announcement of 
a
> >>> >>>>>>>> new motto there, even if we don't have
a new logo (or
> consensus
> >>> >>>>>>>> on one) by that time.
> >>> >>>>>>>>
> >>> >>>>>>>> Thoughts, suggestions, comments?
> >>> >>>>>>>>
> >>> >>>>>>>> -Joan
> >>> >>>>>
> >>> >>>>>
> >>> >>>>>
> >>> >>>>> --
> >>> >>>>> Noah Slater
> >>> >>>>> https://twitter.com/nslater
> >>> >>>>
> >>> >>
> >>> >>
> >>> >>
> >>> >> --
> >>> >> Noah Slater
> >>> >> https://twitter.com/nslater
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>> > --
> >>> > Noah Slater
> >>> > https://twitter.com/nslater
> >>>
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Noah Slater
> > https://twitter.com/nslater
>
>
>
> --
> Noah Slater
> https://twitter.com/nslater
>
>
>


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