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From Nick Pavlica <lini...@gmail.com>
Subject Re: New motto?
Date Fri, 07 Nov 2014 17:41:39 GMT
All,
  As with the logo, I fully agree that the motto needs to be changed.  I
have never been a fan of the "relax" slogan, and have just tried to ignore
it.  As I think about it, I wounder if we really need a motto at all.  The
really hard thing when selecting a motto for something like CouchDB is that
can mean something different to everyone.  However, if there is one
strength that CouchDB has as a main differentiator from other databases is
it's syncing/replication capabilities.

Regards,
-- Nick Pavlica



On Fri Nov 07 2014 at 9:58:26 AM Joan Touzet <wohali@apache.org> wrote:

> FYI I recommend reading:
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raised_fist
>
> for a history of the political implications of that logo.
>
> As to Alex's comment, I like the riff on the French national motto
> of freedom, equality and brotherhood (Liberté, Égalité, Fraternité).
> Worth experimenting a bit more there.
>
> -Joan
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Alexander Shorin" <kxepal@gmail.com>
> To: marketing@couchdb.apache.org
> Cc: "Joan Touzet" <wohali@apache.org>, "Sean Barclay" <sean@cloudant.com>
> Sent: Friday, November 7, 2014 11:50:11 AM
> Subject: Re: New motto?
>
> I think "Liberate" is good one for some Open Data project or toolset
> to work on it, but not for CouchDB which is a database in the first
> place. As for me, my first association with "liberate" was "libre ->
> libreoffice -> wtf", may be because this is rare word for me.  If we
> want (do we?) to focus on replication / data sync everywhere feature
> then the one thing comes to my mind. If anyone still remember this
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E661isduPy8 there was one consonant to
> "liberate" word - "replicate". I think replicate more clear and
> explicitly defines the idea of "free to share your data, free to sync
> it with whatever they want".
>
> "CouchDB. Replicate." or even "CouchDB. Liberate. Replicate." (yo).
>
> --
> ,,,^..^,,,
>
>
> On Fri, Nov 7, 2014 at 6:56 PM, Noah Slater <nslater@apache.org> wrote:
> > Wow, yeah.
> >
> > What do others thing about using this word? "Liberate"? I think it has
> > the right mixture of connotations and meanings
> >
> > On 5 November 2014 23:50, Joan Touzet <wohali@apache.org> wrote:
> >> Worth mentioning that Google has the Data Liberation Front team.
> >>
> >> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google_Data_Liberation_Front
> >>
> >> Interesting (and rather provocative!) logo there.
> >>
> >> -Joan
> >>
> >> ----- Original Message -----
> >> From: "Noah Slater" <nslater@apache.org>
> >> To: marketing@couchdb.apache.org, "Javier Candeira" <
> javier@candeira.com>
> >> Sent: Wednesday, November 5, 2014 12:52:05 PM
> >> Subject: Re: New motto?
> >>
> >> So, I just mentioned on dev@, but one of the angles I was thinking
> about was:
> >>
> >> - Liberate your data
> >> - Free your data
> >>
> >> Perhaps with "The database that..." before either.
> >>
> >> I think this "liberate" idea taps intot the core of what I think our
> >> "why?" is. We all seem to have the shared goal of wanting to help
> >> people liberate their data, in terms of being able to move it wherever
> >> they want, work on it how they want. Our sync/replication is really
> >> only the implementation ("how?") of that goal.
> >>
> >> "Liberate" as a word, and the associations that go with it, also taps
> >> into a growing movement of indie developers who are trying to move
> >> away from closed data silos and corporate multinationals being in
> >> control of massive amounts of user data.
> >>
> >> It echoes things like Unhoasted, OfflineFirst, POSSE and PESOS.
> >>
> >>
> >> On 1 November 2014 03:24, Javier Candeira <javier@candeira.com> wrote:
> >>> Just brrainstorming, I think the "sync" is the biggest selling point
> >>> of CouchDB. The fact that it doesn't lose data is obviously good
> >>> (cough cough MongoDB cough), but you can hardly advertise "we don't
> >>> lose your data" in your slogan, that should be a given. You don't
> >>> advertise youghourt as "0% cyanide" either.
> >>>
> >>> Another strong point is the ecosystem, with TouchDB/Couchbase
> >>> Lite/PouchDB leading the charge.
> >>>
> >>> So I would like to see a slogan along the lines that express the
> >>> concept of "A database that gets the web, mobile and sync" (not a
> >>> proposal, just a suggestionf or a message.
> >>>
> >>> Or, now in the terrain of slogans, mirroring the famous Dropbox "A
> >>> Folder. On several computers. That syncs", we could say...
> >>>
> >>> "Your data, on the web and on your device, always in sync."
> >>>
> >>> Though that seems too specific, and getting a bit into Hoodie
> territory.
> >>>
> >>> "CouchDB syncs your data to wherever you need to use it". Hmm, it's
> >>> more than just sync.
> >>>
> >>> As I said above, this is just an idea dump, inspired by Noah's great
> >>> reframing of the problem.
> >>>
> >>> J
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Fri, Oct 31, 2014 at 9:44 PM, Jan Lehnardt <jan@apache.org> wrote:
> >>>> Thanks Noah!
> >>>>
> >>>> this is where we need to be heading.
> >>>>
> >>>> As related inspiration, see these storytelling rules by Pixar. Not all
> >>>> apply to what we want to do, but pretend CouchDB is a character and
we
> >>>> want to tell its story: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/
> 2012/07/30/pixar-storytelling_n_1718854.html
> >>>>
> >>>> Best
> >>>> Jan
> >>>> --
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>> On 30 Oct 2014, at 21:16 , Noah Slater <nslater@apache.org>
wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Okay, so a while ago we had this discussion about what CouchDB's
> "why"
> >>>>> was. i.e. What's our purpose.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> There are three questions we can answer, at various points in our
> >>>>> marketing material:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Why? - What's our shared goal?
> >>>>> How? - How are we working towards it?
> >>>>> What? - What are the particulars of that approach.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Most projects get this the wrong way round. In fact, we have done.
We
> >>>>> tell you about JSON and HTTP and whatever up front. That's the what.
> >>>>> It's not interesting.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> We've had suggestions to use the motto "The database that
> >>>>> replicates/syncs". That's better. But this is the how. We're telling
> >>>>> you how we're working towards our shared goal. Still no explicit
> goal.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Now. You look at Apple, and their motto was "think different". It
was
> >>>>> always about challenging the status quo and putting the user first.
> >>>>> They just happened to be doing that by building a computer. (Now
a
> >>>>> phone, a watch, etc, etc...)
> >>>>>
> >>>>> The thing about stating your values up front is that you attract
> >>>>> people with the same values. They "believe" in you and what you're
> >>>>> doing in a very emotional way.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Compare this to Dell. You know anybody who's passionate about Dell?
> >>>>> "Hey, we build powerful computers. Buy one." Okay sure, maybe. But
> I'm
> >>>>> not gonna *feel* anything about it.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> So, let's talk about Couch.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I think that our core value is giving people the power to do what
> they
> >>>>> want with their data. To keep it where ever they want. To move it
> >>>>> where ever they want. And for this to be as easy as possible.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Here's a sample formulation
> >>>>>
> >>>>> "We want to put your data in your hands. We're gonna do that by
> >>>>> making it easy to move your anywhere you want. We just happen to
> >>>>> building a database."
> >>>>>
> >>>>> arkos has a great slogan: "Your data, your rules"
> >>>>>
> >>>>> This is where we need to be heading. This isn't about syncing. This
> is
> >>>>> about giving people the power to move their data into and out of
> >>>>> whatever environment, platform, and device they want to.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Data autonomy?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Some other notes:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Mikeal Rogers said to me that after working with Couch, he started
to
> >>>>> take it for granted that getting data back out of a database should
> be
> >>>>> as easy as putting it in. (But apparently this isn't so) He said
this
> >>>>> was a unique feature of CouchDB.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Tom Dale once said something about the need to share and distribute
> >>>>> data. No silos. Host individual sites in your own server. Can't
> >>>>> remember the context, just have it in my notes.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> But this ties into the IndieWebCamp concept of POSSE.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> http://indiewebcamp.com/POSSE
> >>>>>
> >>>>> And also dovetails with OfflineFirst, things like unhosted, and
the
> >>>>> growing movement of people who want  local data ownership.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Also think about the fact that CouchDB is more like Git than
> >>>>> PostgreSQL. (Thanks Jan, for the analogy.) Decentralised data,
> >>>>> workflows, syncing, etc. What is this about really? It's about
> >>>>> enabling decentralised data management. Ties into the same concept.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Access your data anywhere
> >>>>> Access your data offline
> >>>>> Decentralised data management
> >>>>> Puts you in control of your own data
> >>>>> Local data ownership
> >>>>> Grants you data autonomy
> >>>>> Your data, your rules
> >>>>> Puts your data back in your hands
> >>>>>
> >>>>> ^ Not slogans, just prompts.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> What's our why? If we find that, we'll have our slogan.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On 30 October 2014 19:45, Andy Ellicott <andy@cloudant.com>
wrote:
> >>>>>> I think I read something recently that there's more mobile than
web
> app development happening these days, so "web" might end up sounding
> outdated.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Random input:
> >>>>>> "Synchronicity" is a word we're using to differentiate
> couchdb-style dbs from others. Feel free to reuse or take inspiration from
> that...or not :)
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Andy
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Sent from my iPhone
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>> On Oct 30, 2014, at 2:35 PM, Alexander Shorin <kxepal@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Will repeat myself on IRC:
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> "A database for the web" isn't good one since PouchDB is
eventually
> >>>>>>> more "database for the web" than CouchDB now.
> >>>>>>> We need something more fresh, unique and collision safe
as like as
> >>>>>>> "Time to relax!" was - it's hard to associate any other
database
> with
> >>>>>>> the same motto.
> >>>>>>> --
> >>>>>>> ,,,^..^,,,
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> On Thu, Oct 30, 2014 at 9:01 PM, Joan Touzet <joant@lrtw.org>
> wrote:
> >>>>>>>> Coming out of the logo discussion, it seems 2.0 may
be the
> >>>>>>>> right time to consider a new motto, replacing "Time
to relax."
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> PouchDB is "The database that syncs."
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> On http://couchdb.apache.org/ today, "A database for
the web"
> >>>>>>>> is the most prominent motto, bigger than "Relax."
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> Jan and I will be on stage in 3 weeks in Budapest to
present
> >>>>>>>> plans for CouchDB 2.0. I'd love to make an announcement
of a
> >>>>>>>> new motto there, even if we don't have a new logo (or
consensus
> >>>>>>>> on one) by that time.
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> Thoughts, suggestions, comments?
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> -Joan
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> --
> >>>>> Noah Slater
> >>>>> https://twitter.com/nslater
> >>>>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> Noah Slater
> >> https://twitter.com/nslater
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Noah Slater
> > https://twitter.com/nslater
>

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