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From Noah Slater <nsla...@apache.org>
Subject Re: AdvocateHub rewards
Date Fri, 31 Oct 2014 17:38:37 GMT
So, I actually brought up the idea of dedicating the release on a dev@
thread. The only people to respond there were +1 on the idea. But Jan
and Lena are -1 one on the idea here and have requested we put this
reward on hold. I still think it would be a good idea, but I'm happy
to put the idea on the back burner. I'll also table the "name the
news" idea. We can revisit in the future.

Thanks for the feedback folks.

On 31 October 2014 14:15, Andy Wenk <andywenk@apache.org> wrote:
> On 31 October 2014 13:30, Jan Lehnardt <jan@apache.org> wrote:
>
>>
>> > On 31 Oct 2014, at 09:25 , Andy Wenk <andywenk@apache.org> wrote:
>> >
>> > Jan,
>> >
>> > this is a very fair point. But I think it could be avoided if we add sth.
>> > like "Thanks to all the awesome work of the contributors, this release is
>> > again so cool ..." If there is a very big part created by one person, why
>> > not name him also?
>>
>> Or her. It puts focus on things that are shippable. It shadows things that
>> go on in the background, that are essential, say JIRA triaging or Pull
>> Request Reviews. Someone might spend more time on that than someone else
>> with a big new feature and they wouldn’t get credit. I’d like to avoid
>> that,
>> and I think we have plenty of good incentives. It’s not that we are at a
>> loss as to what to offer people.
>>
>
> sry - for sure her also. I do understand this. Again, dedicating a  release
> does not have to do anything with value compared to other contributions.
> But I see the point that this could be viewed from the outside in that way.
> What would be wrong.
>
>
>> > But on the other hand, we have the contributors list and
>> > the people earn respect because they can be found in the commit history.
>> > The developers working on CouchDB do it, because they believe in the
>> > project and want to help creating awesome software. Not to see their name
>> > in any special announcement. At least, that's the point for me.
>>
>> Exactly, we should value people because they are committed to CouchDB,
>> regardless of their contribution. Highlighting some people in the community
>> creates a disparity that can have very adverse effects on a community.
>>
>
> That is very true. You are right.
>
>
>> > So I can understand your (and Lena's) concerns but I personally do not
>> see
>> > this a s such a big issue.
>>
>> Both Lena and I had some experience with this this year in a community of
>> six people and avoiding a mix of “shipping culture” and “hero worship” and
>> instead a focus on people made all the difference for us.
>>
>
> sorry to hear that. I would be more than sad if the outcome of this
> marketing idea would be something like this. With this knowledge, I am
> starting to be convinced, that the idea could result in problems for the
> community. I am strongly against taking this risk.
>
>
>> > Maybe we could make a quick questionnaire (Google form thingy?) on dev@
>> > to get a feeling for this?
>>
>> Why is there a need to push this through? We have plenty of rewards for
>> AdvocateHub. Let’s get that out and see how it goes. If we need to dial
>> up the reward-meter, let’s get back together and think about what we can
>> offer.
>>
>
> Because it is good to know how we can rise the reward-meter from the
> beginning. That was the idea. Keep it open and learn what the community
> thinks about this. But ....
>
>
> I hear you! I am now at the point top agree, that we should start with the
> other rewards. Thanls for taking the time to outline this very clearly <3 :)
>
>
>> Best
>> Jan
>> --
>>
>
> So I am -0 with the idea to dedicate releases at this moment.
>
> Cheers
>
> Andy
>
>> On 30 October 2014 17:43, Jan Lehnardt <jan@apache.org> wrote:
>> >
>> >>
>> >>> On 30 Oct 2014, at 17:37 , Noah Slater <nslater@apache.org> wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> Jan/Lena, could you expand a little on why you don't like the idea of
>> >>> dedicating a release?
>> >>
>> >> I fear that someone who built a significant feature for a release would
>> >> feel they need recognition as well, but they don’t because they aren’t
>> >> reflected in this (AFAIK). If we get into dedicated specific code-
>> >> contributors, where do we do the cutoff? What about people who not write
>> >> features, but review every pull request? It gets messy fast. I don’t
>> want
>> >> to get into that. Plus there are plenty of great rewards already and I’m
>> >> sure once this is rolling, we will think of a lot more, too :)
>> >>
>> >> Best
>> >> Jan
>> >> --
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>> I'm thinking it would be a small para at the bottom of the release
>> >>> announcement, something like this:
>> >>>
>> >>> "This release is dedicated to the following advocates as a thank you
>> >>> for helping grow the community: Alice, Bob, Chris"
>> >>>
>> >>> Perhaps we could even add some sort of clarification as to why they're
>> >>> being thanked.
>> >>>
>> >>> Lena, for naming the release: we can exercise editorial control by
>> >>> simply saying "that's not gonna fly, pick a different name." Would
>> >>> that allay your concerns?
>> >>>
>> >>> On 30 October 2014 17:11, Lena Reinhard <lena@thehoodiefirm.com>
>> wrote:
>> >>>> Also like all of them, except
>> >>>>
>> >>>>>> - Have a release dedicated to you
>> >>>>
>> >>>> I'd rather avoid that, as it sets the reward at a wrong place, imo.
>> >>>>
>> >>>>>> - Name the weekly news
>> >>>>
>> >>>> My main issue with this is that I fear running into discussions
what
>> is
>> >> appropriate as a name (in terms of our bylaws and CoC (which wouldn't
>> have
>> >> to be a discussion then at all), but also in terms of marketing.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Rest looks great from my side.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> On 30 Oct 2014, at 16:51, Jan Lehnardt <jan@apache.org> wrote:
>> >>>>
>> >>>>> I like them al except “Have a release dedicated to you”
:)
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>> On 30 Oct 2014, at 16:41 , Noah Slater <nslater@apache.org>
wrote:
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> Hello,
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> I'd like to set up the following rewards. Please review.
If nobody
>> >>>>>> objects to this email, I will assume consensus.
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> Lena, a few of these relate to the weekly news, so I'm hoping
you
>> can
>> >>>>>> look it over specifically in case you have any objections
or
>> >>>>>> suggestions for improvement!
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> - #FollowFriday
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> We include the advocate in a #FollowFriday tweet sent from
@CouchDB.
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> - Individual Twitter thank you
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> We post a tweet from @CouchDB, individually thanking the
advocate.
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> - Thank you in the weekly news
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> We include the advocate's name on a list of people we're
thanking in
>> >>>>>> the next weekly news. (This would appear at the bottom of
the post.)
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> - Individual profile in the weekly news
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> We add a short para, no longer than a tweet (perhaps?) to
the bottom
>> >>>>>> of the weekly news, in a special thanks section (or similar).
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> - Get featured on the website
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> Join the list of featured advocates on our main homepage.
We'd keep
>> X
>> >>>>>> advocates here, removing people off as new people join.
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> (This actually doubles as recruitment for new advocates.)
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> - Enter the Hall of Fame
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> The advocates name is added to the ADVOCATES file in the
root of the
>> >>>>>> main CouchDB repository.
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> - Have a release dedicated to you
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> The advocates name is added to a list of people that our
next
>> release
>> >>>>>> is dedicated to. This will appear at the bottom of the release
>> >>>>>> announcement.
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> - Name the weekly news
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> The advocate gets to pick a fun name for the next weekly
news. This
>> is
>> >>>>>> included at the top of the weekly news in the style of "aka
the X
>> >>>>>> update" or similar.
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> (This is just a small selection of the rewards, focusing
here on
>> >>>>>> recognition. I have other ideas, but I don't want to swap
you.)
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> Thanks,
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> --
>> >>>>>> Noah Slater
>> >>>>>> https://twitter.com/nslater
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> --
>> >>> Noah Slater
>> >>> https://twitter.com/nslater
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > Andy Wenk
>> > Hamburg - Germany
>> > RockIt!
>> >
>> > GPG fingerprint: C044 8322 9E12 1483 4FEC 9452 B65D 6BE3 9ED3 9588
>> >
>> > https://people.apache.org/keys/committer/andywenk.asc
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Andy Wenk
> Hamburg - Germany
> RockIt!
>
> GPG fingerprint: C044 8322 9E12 1483 4FEC 9452 B65D 6BE3 9ED3 9588
>
>  https://people.apache.org/keys/committer/andywenk.asc



-- 
Noah Slater
https://twitter.com/nslater

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