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From Joan Touzet <woh...@apache.org>
Subject Re: [DISCUSS] Improved CouchDB logo
Date Sun, 02 Nov 2014 21:03:52 GMT
I'm in line with Andy on the blue, probably not good messaging.

Green is PouchDB's colour so best to let them use that, too.

Red, dark red, orange are fine by me.

I also agree that the last row is the best, I don't like the "ouchDB"
that people might read if they don't know that the semicircular thing is
a C.

Short story: Many years ago I worked for Soma Networks. Their first logo
was a perfect circle with two sorta offset symbols on top of it.  They
used to position the logo to the left of the Soma Networks text.

  http://www.huntingtonventures.com/images/logos/soma.gif

TSA started stopping our employees at the US border who were wearing
shirts/jackets with the logo: "Wait, you work for OSAMA NETWORKS?" >_<

After that, the logo was moved directly above the Soma Networks text
so all confusion was removed...at great expense to reprint everything...

-Joan

----- Original Message -----
From: "Andy Wenk" <andywenk@apache.org>
To: dev@couchdb.apache.org
Sent: Saturday, November 1, 2014 3:51:15 PM
Subject: Re: [DISCUSS] Improved CouchDB logo

Nick,

thanks 1000 times for taking the action and create these ideas. This is
what we need to find a route to a "maybe" new logo. Everything I write
below is very direct and I ask you very much to take it as my personal view
and as constructive criticism. Again - I highly appreciate your work!

I have to admit, that I don't like the first and second ideas. I simply
read OuchDB (Alex mentioned it before). Imho it's a no go.

The third line is a better idea but is not better that what we have. It is
definitely very modern. Some words to the colours (last row):

* sorry I don't like green ;-)
* orange is not strong enough as a colour
* blue is cool but is Cloudant's main colour an also used heavily by
Couchbase (http://www.couchbase.com/).
* red ... is what I like
* dark red and red is ... hm ... dunno - I don't like it too much

The only colours I like is blue and red. But blue can have some problems
like:

* it's Cloudant's colour
* Cloudant does now belong to IBM
* IBM is blue
* ah - CouchDB is also blue now - maybe they are now a IBM OpenSource
Project?
* ... ähm ... nope!

I think that IF we create a new logo, we should keep a "link" to the old
one in some way. I am afraid I don't see this here ...

Thanks a lot and Cheers

Andy


On 1 November 2014 10:09, Alexander Shorin <kxepal@gmail.com> wrote:

> OuchDB! You made it (:
> Circular designs are really nice: they have the project name, two
> curved couches directed to each other suggests party communication /
> data replication and multiple colours allows to fit it surrounding
> environment better.  Though we're seems going to drop Relax moto...
> --
> ,,,^..^,,,
>
>
> On Sat, Nov 1, 2014 at 11:04 AM,  <justin@villageonline.info> wrote:
> > Hi Nick,
> >
> > These look great.
> >
> > I like the circular designs - how would these look with the current
> colours (ie Reds, white and black) ?
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Justin
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Nick Pavlica [mailto:linicks@gmail.com]
> > Sent: 31 October 2014 23:49
> > To: dev@couchdb.apache.org; andywenk@apache.org
> > Subject: Re: [DISCUSS] Improved CouchDB logo
> >
> > All,
> >
> >
> >> Hey Nick,
> >>
> >> attachments are not allowed on this ML and are being deleted. Could
> >> you share it via link?
> >>
> >
> >
> >   Sorry, I didn't realize that the ML restricted attachments.  Here is a
> link to the attachment in Dropbox:
> >
> >
> > https://www.dropbox.com/s/4e06ijhfizbd188/couchdb_concept_art.pdf?dl=0
> >
> >   -- Nick
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >>
> >> Looking forward to see your ideas :)
> >>
> >> Cheers
> >>
> >> Andy
> >>
> >> On 1 November 2014 00:07, Nick Pavlica <linicks@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> > All,
> >> >   I'v crated some conceptual artwork in hopes of moving this
> >> > discussion forward (see attached pdf).  The main idea is to get away
> >> > from the couch with the human figure on it, and go with a top view
> >> > of a circular, or conversation couch as we call them in the U.S.  I
> >> > tried to stay true to
> >> the
> >> > current logo by retaining the motto, and Apache designation.  Of
> >> > course this is a work in progress, and I look forward your feedback.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Regards,
> >> >
> >> > -- Nick Pavlica
> >> >
> >> > On Thu, Oct 30, 2014 at 12:05 PM, Joan Touzet <wohali@apache.org>
> wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> I have started a new marketing@ thread on changing the motto, as
> >> >> it's
> >> not
> >> >> a developer-related issue.
> >> >>
> >> >> Trying to get this thread back on track, if people have new logo
> >> >> suggestions - real ones, well designed, not jokes or vitriol,
> >> >> please
> >> post
> >> >> them here for us to get a look at. We don't need an official
> >> announcement
> >> >> about a logo search/contest to start accepting submissions.
> >> >>
> >> >> -Joan
> >> >>
> >> >> ----- Original Message -----
> >> >> From: "Andy Wenk" <andywenk@apache.org>
> >> >> To: dev@couchdb.apache.org
> >> >> Sent: Thursday, October 30, 2014 1:09:24 PM
> >> >> Subject: Re: [DISCUSS] Improved CouchDB logo
> >> >>
> >> >> Jan,
> >> >>
> >> >> thanks for your list :) . That reflects and summarises my thoughts
> >> >> as
> >> well
> >> >>
> >> >> @Noah ... I understand confusion with Couchbase in social media. I
> >> >> was
> >> not
> >> >> really aware of that. So I support the point working on that issue
> >> >> but
> >> am
> >> >> still -1 in changing the name
> >> >>
> >> >> Cheers
> >> >>
> >> >> Andy
> >> >>
> >> >> On 30 October 2014 17:49, Jan Lehnardt <jan@apache.org> wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> > Ah, sorry, I thought this was in reply to me. Hooray for
> >> >> > non-threaded
> >> >> MUAs
> >> >> > :/
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> > > On 30 Oct 2014, at 17:47 , Noah Slater <nslater@apache.org>
> wrote:
> >> >> > >
> >> >> > > I was replying to this thread:
> >> >> > >
> >> >> > > Andy:
> >> >> > >> sure - IF we want to rename then with 2.0. But before
I give
> >> >> > >> my
> >> >> whatever
> >> >> > > vote, I would like to know which advantages you expect to
get
> >> >> > > with a
> >> >> > rename
> >> >> > > .... as of now - I can only think of negative aspects ...
> >> >> > >
> >> >> > > Noah:
> >> >> > >> Clear up massive brand confusion with Couchbase, basically.
> >> >> > >
> >> >> > > Andy:
> >> >> > >> I am not sure how big this special issue is because I
clearly
> >> >> > >> see
> >> the
> >> >> > > situation from CouchDB. If we have a look to the people on
the
> >> >> > > ML
> >> who
> >> >> > think
> >> >> > > it's Couchbase, that's very minimal ... I would prefer to
keep
> >> >> > > the
> >> >> name
> >> >> > and
> >> >> > > clarify the situation as often as possible
> >> >> > >
> >> >> > > On 30 October 2014 17:45, Jan Lehnardt <jan@apache.org>
wrote:
> >> >> > >> My comment on Couchbase was related to the logo, not
the name.
> >> >> > >>
> >> >> > >> Best
> >> >> > >> Jan
> >> >> > >> --
> >> >> > >>
> >> >> > >>
> >> >> > >>
> >> >> > >>> On 30 Oct 2014, at 17:39 , Noah Slater <nslater@apache.org>
> >> wrote:
> >> >> > >>>
> >> >> > >>> No, because of the name.
> >> >> > >>>
> >> >> > >>> On 30 October 2014 17:34, Jan Lehnardt <jan@apache.org>
wrote:
> >> >> > >>>>
> >> >> > >>>>> On 30 Oct 2014, at 17:33 , Noah Slater <nslater@apache.org>
> >> >> wrote:
> >> >> > >>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>> The confusion with Couchbase is large, widespread,
and
> >> >> > >>>>> shows no
> >> >> signs
> >> >> > >>>>> of resolving itself any time soon. This issue
is constantly
> >> >> coming up
> >> >> > >>>>> on social media, in person, and so on.
> >> >> > >>>>
> >> >> > >>>> Because of the logo? I hardly think so.
> >> >> > >>>>
> >> >> > >>>> Best
> >> >> > >>>> Jan
> >> >> > >>>> --
> >> >> > >>>>
> >> >> > >>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>> On 30 October 2014 17:04, Andy Wenk <andywenk@apache.org>
> >> wrote:
> >> >> > >>>>>> On 30 October 2014 16:47, Noah Slater
<nslater@apache.org>
> >> >> wrote:
> >> >> > >>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>> Clear up massive brand confusion
with Couchbase, basically.
> >> >> > >>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>> I am not sure how big this special issue
is because I
> >> >> > >>>>>> clearly
> >> see
> >> >> > the
> >> >> > >>>>>> situation from CouchDB. If we have a
look to the people on
> >> >> > >>>>>> the
> >> ML
> >> >> > who think
> >> >> > >>>>>> it's Couchbase, that's very minimal ...
I would prefer to
> >> >> > >>>>>> keep
> >> >> the
> >> >> > name and
> >> >> > >>>>>> clarify the situation as often as possible
> >> >> > >>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>> On 30 October 2014 16:35, Andy Wenk
<andywenk@apache.org>
> >> >> wrote:
> >> >> > >>>>>>>> sure - IF we want to rename then
with 2.0. But before I
> >> >> > >>>>>>>> give
> >> my
> >> >> > whatever
> >> >> > >>>>>>>> vote, I would like to know which
advantages you expect
> >> >> > >>>>>>>> to get
> >> >> > with a
> >> >> > >>>>>>> rename
> >> >> > >>>>>>>> .... as of now - I can only think
of negative aspects ...
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>> On 30 October 2014 16:08, Jason
Smith <
> >> jason.h.smith@gmail.com
> >> >> >
> >> >> > wrote:
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>> Love it. Get away from the
WhateverDB thing. Just stake
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>> out
> >> an
> >> >> > arbitrary
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>> mark from which we build
clear, unambiguous IP.
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>> My proposal (as long as we
are brainstorming names):
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>  Eight Ball
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>> Tagline: Whatever you do.
Don't get more eight ball!
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>> More seriously, yes, a name
change has lots of
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>> problems. But
> >> >> it
> >> >> > is worth
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>> re-considering Noah's point
that now is the best time
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>> to do
> >> >> it,
> >> >> > if it
> >> >> > >>>>>>> is to
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>> be done.
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>> On Thu, Oct 30, 2014 at 10:02
PM, Noah Slater <
> >> >> > nslater@apache.org>
> >> >> > >>>>>>> wrote:
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>> I've been wanting to
rename it SleepyDB for a while now.
> >> (cf.
> >> >> > Max
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>> Ogden's SLEEP protocol.)
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>> On 30 October 2014 11:43,
Kevin Coombes <
> >> >> > kevin.r.coombes@gmail.com>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>> wrote:
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> Definitely -1 on
changing the name. It's already
> "cooked"
> >> >> into
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>> everything
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> associated with the
project. There are links (and
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> hard
> >> copy
> >> >> > >>>>>>> references)
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>> to
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> the name and the
web site(s) all over the place. How
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> long
> >> do
> >> >> > you
> >> >> > >>>>>>> want
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>> to
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>> be
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> forced to maintain
DNS or HTTP entries to forward
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> users
> >> from
> >> >> > the
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>> current
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> names to whatever
you might pick for new ones?
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> I would be perfectly
happy to see a new logo however.
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> And
> >> >> the
> >> >> > last
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>> time I
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> looked, there were
a lot more colors than just red or
> >> >> blue....
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> Kevin
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> On Oct 30, 2014 6:11
AM, "Brad Noble"
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> <bradn@us.ibm.com>
> >> >> > wrote:
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> *SyncDB*
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> The database
that syncs.
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Logo would embody
that idea.
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> [image: Inactive
hide details for Jason Smith
> >> ---10/30/2014
> >> >> > >>>>>>> 04:40:26
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> AM---On Thu,
Oct 30, 2014 at 12:52 AM, Noah Slater
> >> >> > <nslater@apache
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>> ]Jason
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Smith ---10/30/2014
04:40:26 AM---On Thu, Oct 30,
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> 2014 at
> >> >> > 12:52 AM,
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>> Noah
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Slater <nslater@apache.org>
wrote: > Blue is nice.
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> :)
> >> But
> >> >> the
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> From: Jason Smith
<jason.h.smith@gmail.com>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> To: "dev@couchdb.apache.org"
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> <dev@couchdb.apache.org>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Date: 10/30/2014
04:40 AM
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re:
[DISCUSS] Improved CouchDB logo
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Oct 30,
2014 at 12:52 AM, Noah Slater <
> >> >> > nslater@apache.org>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>> wrote:
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Blue is nice.
:) But then that tempts me to change
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the
> >> >> name
> >> >> > too.
> >> >> > >>>>>>> I
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> mean, if
we're ever going to do this, now is the
> time.
> >> >> It's
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>> important
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> to note though
that we have a very STRONG brand,
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> and
> >> >> > changing it
> >> >> > >>>>>>> in
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>> a
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> big will
be expensive.
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Change the name!
Change the name!
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Like all transitions,
it seems scary. But once it's
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> done
> >> we
> >> >> > will
> >> >> > >>>>>>> all
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>> wonder
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> what we were
so worried about.
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> The brand is
strong, but the question is, how much
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> of
> >> that
> >> >> > strength
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>> can
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>> we
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> keep, and how
much do we lose.
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> I think we will
keep nearly all of it, plus we will
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> get
> >> >> tons
> >> >> > of
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>> attention
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> with a 2.0 release
and name change. And as if that
> >> already
> >> >> > isn't
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>> enough, we
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> get the opportunity
to walk away from a ton of
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> branding
> >> >> > baggage and
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> trademark problems.
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Change the name!
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>> --
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>> Noah Slater
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>> https://twitter.com/nslater
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>> --
> >> >> > >>>>>>>> Andy Wenk
> >> >> > >>>>>>>> Hamburg - Germany
> >> >> > >>>>>>>> RockIt!
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>> GPG fingerprint: C044 8322 9E12
1483 4FEC 9452 B65D 6BE3
> >> >> > >>>>>>>> 9ED3
> >> >> 9588
> >> >> > >>>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>> https://people.apache.org/keys/committer/andywenk.asc
> >> >> > >>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>> --
> >> >> > >>>>>>> Noah Slater
> >> >> > >>>>>>> https://twitter.com/nslater
> >> >> > >>>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>> --
> >> >> > >>>>>> Andy Wenk
> >> >> > >>>>>> Hamburg - Germany
> >> >> > >>>>>> RockIt!
> >> >> > >>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>> GPG fingerprint: C044 8322 9E12 1483
4FEC 9452 B65D 6BE3
> >> >> > >>>>>> 9ED3
> >> >> 9588
> >> >> > >>>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>> https://people.apache.org/keys/committer/andywenk.asc
> >> >> > >>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>>
> >> >> > >>>>> --
> >> >> > >>>>> Noah Slater
> >> >> > >>>>> https://twitter.com/nslater
> >> >> > >>>>
> >> >> > >>>
> >> >> > >>>
> >> >> > >>>
> >> >> > >>> --
> >> >> > >>> Noah Slater
> >> >> > >>> https://twitter.com/nslater
> >> >> > >>
> >> >> > >
> >> >> > >
> >> >> > >
> >> >> > > --
> >> >> > > Noah Slater
> >> >> > > https://twitter.com/nslater
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> --
> >> >> Andy Wenk
> >> >> Hamburg - Germany
> >> >> RockIt!
> >> >>
> >> >> GPG fingerprint: C044 8322 9E12 1483 4FEC 9452 B65D 6BE3 9ED3 9588
> >> >>
> >> >>  https://people.apache.org/keys/committer/andywenk.asc
> >> >>
> >> >
> >> >
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> Andy Wenk
> >> Hamburg - Germany
> >> RockIt!
> >>
> >> GPG fingerprint: C044 8322 9E12 1483 4FEC 9452 B65D 6BE3 9ED3 9588
> >>
> >>  https://people.apache.org/keys/committer/andywenk.asc
> >>
> >
>



-- 
Andy Wenk
Hamburg - Germany
RockIt!

GPG fingerprint: C044 8322 9E12 1483 4FEC 9452 B65D 6BE3 9ED3 9588

 https://people.apache.org/keys/committer/andywenk.asc

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