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From Michal Mocny <mmo...@chromium.org>
Subject Re: Independent platform release summary
Date Fri, 10 Oct 2014 18:29:02 GMT
4.0! woo hoo.

On Fri, Oct 10, 2014 at 2:10 PM, Josh Soref <jsoref@blackberry.com> wrote:

> Ok, 4.0
>
> On 10/10/14, 2:08 PM, "Steven Gill" <stevengill97@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >Alright, 4.0.
> >
> >On Fri, Oct 10, 2014 at 11:06 AM, Shazron <shazron@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >> 4.0 and let's move on. It's just a number, and is a minor point in the
> >>end.
> >>
> >> On Fri, Oct 10, 2014 at 10:57 AM, Andrew Grieve <agrieve@chromium.org>
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >> > Should we consider jumping to 13? You know... just prefix a 1 onto the
> >> > existing number.
> >> >
> >> > ....
> >> >
> >> > 4.0 (or any other number) is great by me!
> >> >
> >> > On Fri, Oct 10, 2014 at 1:54 PM, Parashuram Narasimhan (MS OPEN TECH)
> >><
> >> > panarasi@microsoft.com> wrote:
> >> >
> >> > > 4.0 is also good. Should we tag and start a vote for that ?
> >> > > Sorry for asking about vote again, but I want to ensure that the
> >>issues
> >> > > that Sergey fixed in the CLI/Lib are impacting some folks and I hope
> >> this
> >> > > release could help them fast.
> >> > >
> >> > > On 10/10/14, 10:17 AM, "Victor Sosa" <sosah.victor@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >> > >
> >> > > >lol... I like that :P
> >> > > >
> >> > > >2014-10-10 12:09 GMT-05:00 Joe Bowser <bowserj@gmail.com>:
> >> > > >
> >> > > >> On Oct 10, 2014 10:05 AM, "Brian LeRoux" <b@brian.io> wrote:
> >> > > >> >
> >> > > >> > OR we move to named releases externally.
> >> > > >> >
> >> > > >> > Cordova MX === 4.0
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >> Cordova Mexico?
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >> > On Oct 10, 2014 10:03 AM, "Michal Mocny" <mmocny@chromium.org>
> >> > wrote:
> >> > > >> >
> >> > > >> > > 4 was also discussed as fine, and in isolation would have
> >>been
> >> our
> >> > > >> choice
> >> > > >> > > for sure -- but we worried that with the impending
> >>"cordova-4.0"
> >> > > >> releases,
> >> > > >> > > it would confuse users and not mark a clear departure from
> >> cadver.
> >> > > >> > >
> >> > > >> > > The more I think about it though, the less important I think
> >> that
> >> > > >>worry
> >> > > >> > > is.  Maybe 4.0 is fine.
> >> > > >> > >
> >> > > >> > > (Apologies to Steve, who just wants to get this over with)
> >> > > >> > >
> >> > > >> > > On Fri, Oct 10, 2014 at 12:48 PM, Brian LeRoux <b@brian.io>
> >> > wrote:
> >> > > >> > >
> >> > > >> > > > As is 4.
> >> > > >> > > >
> >> > > >> > > > This is more of an outreach, marketing, blogging, tweeting,
> >> etc
> >> > > >> problem.
> >> > > >> > > > Versions are for issue tracking not marketing. (Tho semver
> >>and
> >> > our
> >> > > >> > > > respective $BIGCO's confuse that to their and our continued
> >> > > >>strife.)
> >> > > >> > > >
> >> > > >> > > > (All IMO of course, happy to follow the wisdom of the
> >>crowd on
> >> > > >>this
> >> > > >> one.)
> >> > > >> > > > On Oct 10, 2014 9:29 AM, "Michal Mocny"
> >><mmocny@chromium.org>
> >> > > >>wrote:
> >> > > >> > > >
> >> > > >> > > > > 5 is also fine.
> >> > > >> > > > >
> >> > > >> > > > > On Fri, Oct 10, 2014 at 12:17 PM, Brian LeRoux
> >><b@brian.io>
> >> > > >>wrote:
> >> > > >> > > > >
> >> > > >> > > > > > I am against it. Its not going to achieve the goal of
> >> > > >>alleviating
> >> > > >> > > > > > confusion. People see the CLI as the version not the
> >> > > >>platforms.
> >> > > >> I'd
> >> > > >> > > > > rather
> >> > > >> > > > > > we went to 5 if anything.
> >> > > >> > > > > > On Oct 9, 2014 3:56 PM, "Parashuram Narasimhan (MS OPEN
> >> > > >>TECH)" <
> >> > > >> > > > > > panarasi@microsoft.com> wrote:
> >> > > >> > > > > >
> >> > > >> > > > > > > I meant tag and start the vote for the next release
> >>:)
> >> > > >> > > > > > >
> >> > > >> > > > > > > On 10/9/14, 3:01 PM, "Chuck Lantz" <
> >> clantz@microsoft.com>
> >> > > >> wrote:
> >> > > >> > > > > > >
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >+1
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >-Chuck
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >-----Original Message-----
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >From: Jesse [mailto:purplecabbage@gmail.com]
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >Sent: Thursday, October 9, 2014 2:55 PM
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >To: dev@cordova.apache.org
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >Subject: Re: Independent platform release summary
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >+1 to not voting ;) , it implies we will wait 72
> >>hours
> >> > > >>before
> >> > > >> > > moving
> >> > > >> > > > > on.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >How about if anyone is completely against 10.0.0
> >>they
> >> > > >>voice it
> >> > > >> > > here,
> >> > > >> > > > > in
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >the next couple hours, otherwise we move forward.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >@purplecabbage
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >risingj.com
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >On Thu, Oct 9, 2014 at 2:52 PM, Steven Gill <
> >> > > >> > > stevengill97@gmail.com
> >> > > >> > > > >
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >wrote:
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> I don't think a vote is necessary. I'd hate to
> >>see us
> >> > > >>resort
> >> > > >> to
> >> > > >> > > > > voting
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> to solve problems. Voting should be a last resort
> >>if
> >> > > >> consensus
> >> > > >> > > is
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> split. I don't see that in this scenario.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> I propose we bumb the version up to 10.0.0.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> On Thu, Oct 9, 2014 at 2:45 PM, Parashuram
> >>Narasimhan
> >> > (MS
> >> > > >> OPEN
> >> > > >> > > > > TECH) <
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> panarasi@microsoft.com> wrote:
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > Lets start with a vote for 10.0.0 ? And if
> >>someone
> >> > > >>feels
> >> > > >> > > > strongly
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > about calling it something the vote could be
> >> > cancelled
> >> > > >>!!
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> >
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > On 10/9/14, 2:41 PM, "Chuck Lantz"
> >> > > >><clantz@microsoft.com>
> >> > > >> > > > wrote:
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> >
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >Yeah agreed - Vladimir squashed the bug and
> >>what
> >> was
> >> > > >>at
> >> > > >> once
> >> > > >> > > > > point
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >to be called 3.7.0 has been mainly waiting on a
> >> > > >>version
> >> > > >> > > number.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >Personally I am fine with 10.0.0 or 5.0.0 -
> >>Either
> >> > > >>send
> >> > > >> the
> >> > > >> > > > > message
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >that platform versions are divorced from the
> >>CLI
> >> > from
> >> > > >>a
> >> > > >> > > > > versioning
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >perspective (though behavior is still
> >> predictable).
> >> > > >>Leo
> >> > > >> - I
> >> > > >> > > > > think
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >at least out of the gate devs will likely
> >>focus on
> >> > the
> >> > > >> CLI
> >> > > >> > > > > version
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >as primary.  Basically today, the cadence
> >>version
> >> of
> >> > > >>the
> >> > > >> CLI
> >> > > >> > > is
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >what people talk about.  Heck, Cordova
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >3.4.1 was 3.4.0 for all platforms but iOS.  The
> >> main
> >> > > >> message
> >> > > >> > > is
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >that
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> when
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >you platform add android, you may see an npm
> >>pull
> >> > for
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >cordova-android@4.3.2 and that is expected.
> >>It's
> >> > > just
> >> > > >> > > > > formalizing
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >the message and allows independent platform
> >> rev'ing.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >-Chuck
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >-----Original Message-----
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >From: Steven Gill
> >>[mailto:stevengill97@gmail.com]
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >Sent: Thursday, October 9, 2014 2:13 PM
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >To: dev@cordova.apache.org
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >Cc: Michal Mocny; Marcel Kinard
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >Subject: Re: Independent platform release
> >>summary
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >I think vladimir fixed the bug. We just need to
> >> > > >>release
> >> > > >> now.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >Only thing holding back the release now is
> >> consensus
> >> > > >>on
> >> > > >> the
> >> > > >> > > > > version
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >of the cli. It seemed like most people were
> >> leaning
> >> > > >> toward
> >> > > >> > > > > 10.0.0.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >Should I move forward with that? I would just
> >>have
> >> > to
> >> > > >> branch
> >> > > >> > > +
> >> > > >> > > > > pin
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >deps
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >Leo the documentation version dropdown box
> >>would
> >> be
> >> > > >>tied
> >> > > >> to
> >> > > >> > > cli
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >>version.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >It still makes sense to copy over platform
> >> > > >>documentation
> >> > > >> into
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >platform repos and maybe copy it into docs
> >>during
> >> > > >> generation
> >> > > >> > > > > time.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >As for plugin pinning, plugins have more to do
> >> with
> >> > > >> > > platforms.
> >> > > >> > > > I
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> wouldn't
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >say they aren't tied to the cli at all. I
> >> understand
> >> > > >>your
> >> > > >> > > point
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >>though.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >So far, we haven't had any plugins that won't
> >>work
> >> > > >>with
> >> > > >> > > > previous
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> versions
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >(As far as I know). We should really fix the
> >> engine
> >> > > >>stuff
> >> > > >> for
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >plugins so we can keep track of what platforms
> >> they
> >> > > >>work
> >> > > >> for.
> >> > > >> > > > I'd
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >like us to give warnings to users to update
> >>their
> >> > > >>plugins
> >> > > >> if
> >> > > >> > > > > newer
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >>versions are out.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >Cordova info should also dump what versions of
> >> > plugins
> >> > > >> you
> >> > > >> > > have
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> installed
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >if it doesn't already. In combination with
> >>cordova
> >> > > >>--save
> >> > > >> &
> >> > > >> > > > > cordova
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >--restore, we should be able to recommend a
> >> workflow
> >> > > >>that
> >> > > >> is
> >> > > >> > > > > easily
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >reproducible on any machine.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >On Thu, Oct 9, 2014 at 1:44 PM, Chuck Lantz <
> >> > > >> > > > > clantz@microsoft.com>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> wrote:
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> Okay - so - there's a pretty nasty CLI
> >>blocker
> >> bug
> >> > > >> right
> >> > > >> > > now.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> Plugins with dependencies don't install (this
> >> > > >>affects
> >> > > >> all
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> platforms).  In my opinion, we need to get a
> >>CLI
> >> > > >> release
> >> > > >> > > out
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> really soon.  Are we closed on this topic,
> >>or do
> >> > we
> >> > > >> need to
> >> > > >> > > > > look
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> at doing the old process to get this out the
> >> door
> >> > > >>while
> >> > > >> we
> >> > > >> > > > are
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >>still talking?
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> There are also a series of other bugs in the
> >> > > >>currently
> >> > > >> > > tagged
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >>"3.6.4"
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> platforms for Android, Windows, and Windows
> >> Phone
> >> > 8.
> >> > > >> These
> >> > > >> > > > can
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> be handled independently, but the CLI bug
> >>can't.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>
> https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/CB-7670
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> -Chuck
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> -----Original Message-----
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> From: Treggiari, Leo
> >> > > >>[mailto:leo.treggiari@intel.com]
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> Sent: Thursday, October 9, 2014 12:23 PM
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> To: Michal Mocny
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> Cc: Marcel Kinard; dev
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> Subject: RE: Independent platform release
> >> summary
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> I'll have to admit that this seems a bit
> >>weird.
> >> > > >>That
> >> > > >> is,
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> independent versions of the CLI and
> >>platforms,
> >> > with
> >> > > >>a
> >> > > >> > > > "Cordova
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> release" named "something" - e.g. a date?
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> Imagine a user wants to know whether the new
> >> > > >>whitelist
> >> > > >> > > entry
> >> > > >> > > > in
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> config.xml is supported in the versions of
> >>CLI
> >> and
> >> > > >> > > platforms
> >> > > >> > > > > that
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> they have - assuming they understand the
> >> > distinction
> >> > > >> > > between
> >> > > >> > > > > the
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> CLI and platforms to begin with.  They use
> >>some
> >> > > >>command
> >> > > >> to
> >> > > >> > > > list
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> the versions of the "things" (CLI and
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> platforms) they have installed.  They go to
> >>the
> >> > > >> individual
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> documentation of the "things" and try to
> >>figure
> >> it
> >> > > >>out.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> The way the Cordova documentation works
> >>today is
> >> > > >>nice
> >> > > >> with
> >> > > >> > > > the
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> combo box where I can select a Cordova
> >>version -
> >> > > >>3.6.0,
> >> > > >> > > > 3.5.0,
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> ...  What would the combo box contain in the
> >>new
> >> > > >> versioning
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> scheme and how many entries would there be?
> >>Are
> >> > the
> >> > > >> > > answers
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >>"dates" and "lots of dates"?
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> Or would there be no Cordova version
> >> documentation
> >> > > >> other
> >> > > >> > > than
> >> > > >> > > > > an
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> explanation of how to get the list of
> >>"things"
> >> you
> >> > > >> > > currently
> >> > > >> > > > > have
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> and where to find the documentation on them.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> To "pin" or not to "pin.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> Note that, to me, the pinning choice defines
> >> what
> >> > > >> happens
> >> > > >> > > > when
> >> > > >> > > > > I
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>use  "cordova {plugin | platform} add foo"
> >>with
> >> no
> >> > > >> specific
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>version specified.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> I've understood, so far at least, that
> >>plugins
> >> are
> >> > > >>not
> >> > > >> > > pinned
> >> > > >> > > > > (an
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> add always fetches something) and platforms
> >>are
> >> > > >>pinned
> >> > > >> to a
> >> > > >> > > > CLI
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> version (an add tells the CLI that I will be
> >> using
> >> > > >>that
> >> > > >> > > > > platform
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> (already
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> installed) for this project).  Everything I
> >>have
> >> > > >>read
> >> > > >> which
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> includes 1 book and the on-line project
> >> > > >>documentation,
> >> > > >> > > > suggest
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> that, even if not stating it explicitly.
> >>E.g.
> >> > > >>plugins
> >> > > >> talk
> >> > > >> > > > > about
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> "fetching" and platforms don't.  There is a
> >>way
> >> to
> >> > > >> fetch a
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> specific version of platform support.  That's
> >> good
> >> > > >>and
> >> > > >> if I
> >> > > >> > > > do
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> that it is up to me to understand the
> >> > compatibility
> >> > > >>of
> >> > > >> the
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >>specific version I requested.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> Is this true?  If so then the npm cordova
> >> behavior
> >> > > >> seems
> >> > > >> > > > weird.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> That is, if I "npm install cordova" I get a
> >>set
> >> of
> >> > > >> pinned
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> platforms.  If I "npm update cordova", I get
> >>a
> >> new
> >> > > >>CLI
> >> > > >> and
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> nothing else - i.e. not the platforms that
> >>were
> >> > > >>pinned
> >> > > >> to
> >> > > >> > > > that
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >>version of the CLI?
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> Should the plugin and platform 'pin'
> >>behavior be
> >> > the
> >> > > >> same?
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> Should both be pinned?  Some may find this
> >> > > >>alternative
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >>"blasphemous"
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> but the core plugin versions tested with a
> >> version
> >> > > >>of
> >> > > >> the
> >> > > >> > > CLI
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> could be pinned to the version of the CLI.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> Should both not be pinned?  It would be more
> >> > > >>consistent
> >> > > >> and
> >> > > >> > > > if
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> users are OK with plugins being unpinned, why
> >> not
> >> > > >> > > platforms?
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> But maybe plugins and platforms are
> >>different.
> >> > > >>Plugins
> >> > > >> are
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> purely run-time code.  Platforms are
> >>primarily
> >> > > >>tooling
> >> > > >> with
> >> > > >> > > > > some
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> run-time
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> code.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> Does that difference make the current pinning
> >> > > >>behavior
> >> > > >> the
> >> > > >> > > > best
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> choice.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> Maybe, but personally I would prefer both to
> >>be
> >> > > >>pinned
> >> > > >> -
> >> > > >> > > > i.e. I
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> install a version of Cordova, and until I
> >>update
> >> > it,
> >> > > >> every
> >> > > >> > > > > time I
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> add a platform or 'core' plugin, I get the
> >>same
> >> > > >>thing.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> Leo
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> From: mmocny@google.com [mailto:
> >> mmocny@google.com
> >> > ]
> >> > > >>On
> >> > > >> > > Behalf
> >> > > >> > > > > Of
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> Michal
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> Mocny
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> Sent: Wednesday, October 08, 2014 1:47 PM
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> To: Treggiari, Leo
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> Cc: Michal Mocny; Marcel Kinard; dev
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> Subject: Re: Independent platform release
> >> summary
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> With this direction, there is no single
> >>number.
> >> > > >>Users
> >> > > >> > > should
> >> > > >> > > > > not
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> functionally care about CLI version, so there
> >> will
> >> > > >>just
> >> > > >> be
> >> > > >> > > > the
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> platform versions that matter, really.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> Downstreams can of course put labels on
> >> > > >>combinations of
> >> > > >> > > > > versions,
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> so "PhoneGap 4" may be Android 4, iOS 3.8,
> >>and
> >> > etc.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> On Wed, Oct 8, 2014 at 4:39 PM, Treggiari,
> >>Leo
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> <leo.treggiari@intel.com <mailto:
> >> > > >> leo.treggiari@intel.com
> >> > > >> >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > wrote:
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> > Did I miss anything?
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> I don't think we closed on this (I had to
> >>leave
> >> > the
> >> > > >> > > meeting a
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> little
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> early) but a remaining question is how to
> >> version
> >> > > >>what
> >> > > >> we
> >> > > >> > > > (and
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> users) call "Cordova".  Assuming a "Cordova"
> >> > > >>version is
> >> > > >> a
> >> > > >> > > > point
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> in time collection of the latest CLI version
> >>+
> >> > > >>platform
> >> > > >> > > > > versions
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> + plugin versions.  Is the Cordova version
> >> semver
> >> > > >> (using
> >> > > >> > > what
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> algorithm with respect to its contained
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> components) or is that what you meant by
> >> ""latest
> >> > > >>as
> >> > > >> of
> >> > > >> > > Oct
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> 2014" or something".
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> Thanks,
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> Leo
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> -----Original Message-----
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> From: mmocny@google.com<mailto:
> >> mmocny@google.com>
> >> > > >> [mailto:
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> mmocny@google.com<mailto:mmocny@google.com>]
> >>On
> >> > > >>Behalf
> >> > > >> Of
> >> > > >> > > > > Michal
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> Mocny
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> Sent: Wednesday, October 08, 2014 1:13 PM
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> To: Michal Mocny
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> Cc: Marcel Kinard; dev
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> Subject: Re: Independent platform release
> >> summary
> >> > > >> Thanks
> >> > > >> > > > > everyone
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> for participation in what was a long and
> >> grueling
> >> > > >> > > discussion.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> Summary of current proposal:
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> - Cad-ver is dead.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> - Everything moves Sem-ver, with platforms
> >> > > >>continuing
> >> > > >> from
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> current versions and diverging over time.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> - CLI potentially gets a significant version
> >> bump
> >> > to
> >> > > >> > > showcase
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> this reset (to 5.0 or 10.0, not yet settled)
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> - Pinning default platform versions *will*
> >> > continue
> >> > > >>for
> >> > > >> the
> >> > > >> > > > > time
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> being, but it will be trivial to override the
> >> > > >>default.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> - Platforms will have CLI <engine> tag
> >> equivalent
> >> > > >> (unclear
> >> > > >> > > > yet
> >> > > >> > > > > if
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> as node peerDependency or otherwise) so devs
> >> will
> >> > > >>know
> >> > > >> when
> >> > > >> > > > > they
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> need to upgrade/downgrade CLI for non-default
> >> > > >>platform
> >> > > >> > > > > versions.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> - After a platform update, eventually CLI
> >>will
> >> > > >>release
> >> > > >> to
> >> > > >> > > > "pin"
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> the new default, and bump its PATCH/MINOR
> >> version
> >> > > >> (unless
> >> > > >> > > CLI
> >> > > >> > > > > had
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> a functional update at same time that
> >>requires a
> >> > > >>larger
> >> > > >> > > > bump).
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> - After you update CLI, your existing
> >>projects
> >> > don't
> >> > > >> > > change &
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> platform upgrades remain explicit, but you
> >>will
> >> > now
> >> > > >>get
> >> > > >> > > > > warnings
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> if your installed platforms are older than
> >>the
> >> CLI
> >> > > >> pinned
> >> > > >> > > > > > versions.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> - Event MAJOR changes to platforms are not
> >>MAJOR
> >> > > >> updates to
> >> > > >> > > > the
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> CLI, unless there is an actual breaking
> >>change
> >> to
> >> > > >>the
> >> > > >> CLI
> >> > > >> > > > tool
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> (i.e. new CLI will no longer work with the
> >> > currently
> >> > > >> > > > installed
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >>platform).
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> - Platform and CLI docs have to split out
> >>and be
> >> > > >> released &
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> versioned alongside each (like plugins).
> >>Cross
> >> > > >> references
> >> > > >> > > > from
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> one to the other will only be needed in a few
> >> > > >>places.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> Note: The CLI-Platform compatibility story is
> >> > > >> functionally
> >> > > >> > > no
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>different than we have today.  If you upgrade
> >> your
> >> > > >>CLI
> >> > > >> and
> >> > > >> > > > there
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>is a  breaking change, you will have to
> >>re-create
> >> > > >>your
> >> > > >> > > > projects
> >> > > >> > > > > or
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>downgrade CLI again.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> Now we plan to be more explicit about it and
> >> offer
> >> > > >> > > warnings.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> Note: There is no concept of a "fancy-pants"
> >> > release
> >> > > >> other
> >> > > >> > > > than
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> to say "latest as of Oct 2014" or something.
> >> > > >>Platforms
> >> > > >> > > don't
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> have a single common set of functionality, so
> >> > CadVer
> >> > > >> was
> >> > > >> > > > > somewhat
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> misleading already in that sense.  We could
> >> > > >>introduce a
> >> > > >> > > > concept
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> of "API Level" for exec bridge or something
> >>for
> >> > use
> >> > > >>by
> >> > > >> > > > plugins,
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >>but not sure that has value.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> What wasn't covered that came to mind after
> >>the
> >> > > >>fact:
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> - When there is an update available for CLI,
> >> > should
> >> > > >>we
> >> > > >> > > give a
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> warning to update? (this is useful, but isn't
> >> > common
> >> > > >> for
> >> > > >> > > npm
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> modules.  I think we already do this from
> >> plugman
> >> > > >>when
> >> > > >> you
> >> > > >> > > > try
> >> > > >> > > > > to
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >>publish plugins?).
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> Did I miss anything?
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> -Michal
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> On Wed, Oct 8, 2014 at 12:35 PM, Michal Mocny
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >><mmocny@chromium.org<mailto:
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> mmocny@chromium.org>> wrote:
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> > External Public link for those that just
> >>want
> >> to
> >> > > >> > > > watch/chat:
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >
> >> > > >> > > https://plus.google.com/events/cm4l0vifcig920qkhpn5stqiet4
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> > Hangout link to join the conversation:
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >>
> >> > > >> > > > >
> >> > > >>
> >> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYcNwXEyet4Xv_23HiTl
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> > 4I
> >> K0jsM4NlmGy5kbLsPIW3SnOsUEIQ?authuser=0&hl=en
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> > See you in 30 minutes.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> > On Wed, Oct 8, 2014 at 12:33 PM, Michal
> >>Mocny
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> > <mmocny@chromium.org
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> <mailto:mmocny@chromium.org>> wrote:
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >> +dev list again
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >> Not everyone could make 1pm, not everyone
> >> could
> >> > > >>make
> >> > > >> > > 2pm.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >> While I don't think we need a full 2
> >>hours,
> >> I'm
> >> > > >> hoping
> >> > > >> > > to
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >> start late and end early -- proving
> >> opportunity
> >> > > >> people
> >> > > >> > > to
> >> > > >> > > > > pop
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >> in at either time and chime
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> in.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >> On Wed, Oct 8, 2014 at 12:18 PM, Marcel
> >> Kinard
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >> <cmarcelk@gmail.com<mailto:
> >> cmarcelk@gmail.com
> >> > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >> wrote:
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >>> Is the expected duration 1 hour or 2
> >>hours?
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >>>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >>> On Oct 8, 2014, at 10:56 AM, Michal Mocny
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >><mmocny@chromium.org<mailto:
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> mmocny@chromium.org>> wrote:
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >>>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >>> > So it looks like Today 1-3 EST or
> >>Friday
> >> 1-3
> >> > > >>EST
> >> > > >> are
> >> > > >> > > > the
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >>> > best
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>times.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >>> I'm
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >>> > going to start the ball rolling to do
> >>this
> >> > > >>TODAY,
> >> > > >> but
> >> > > >> > > > if
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >>> > that proves
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >>> too
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >>> > short notices we'll move it to Friday.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >>> >
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >>> > I'll email out links to hangout at
> >>12:30
> >> or
> >> > > >>so,
> >> > > >> and
> >> > > >> > > I'm
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >>> > hoping Steven
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >>> can
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >>> > make it before 2pm since he's been most
> >> > active
> >> > > >> with
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >>> > releases
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> recently.
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >>> >
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >>> > -Michal
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >>>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >>>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >> >
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> >
> >> > > >> > > > >
> >> > > >>
> >>>-------------------------------------------------------------------
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >-- To unsubscribe, e-mail:
> >> > > >> > > dev-unsubscribe@cordova.apache.org
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >For additional commands, e-mail:
> >> > > >> dev-help@cordova.apache.org
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > >
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> >
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> >
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> >
> >> > > >> > > > >
> >> > > >>
> >>--------------------------------------------------------------------
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > - To unsubscribe, e-mail:
> >> > > >> dev-unsubscribe@cordova.apache.org
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> > For additional commands, e-mail:
> >> > > >> dev-help@cordova.apache.org
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> >
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >> >
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >>
> >> > > >> > > > > > >
> >> > > >> > > > > >
> >> > > >> > > > >
> >> > > >> > > >
> >> > > >> > >
> >> > > >>
> >> > >
> >> >
> >>
> >>>>>?B�KKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKK
> >>>>>KC
> >> > > >>>B�
> >> > > >> > > > > > >
> >> > > >> > > > > >
> >> > > >> > > > >
> >> > > >> > > >
> >> > > >> > >
> >> > > >>
> >> > >
> >> >
> >>
> >>>>>?�?[��X��ܚX�K??K[XZ[?�??]�][��X��ܚX�P?�ܙ?ݘK�\?X�?K�ܙ�B��܈?Y??]?[ۘ[??��
> >>>>>[X
> >> > > >>>[�
> >> > > >> > > > > > > >?�??K[XZ[?�??]�Z?[???�ܙ?ݘK�\?X�?K�ܙ�B
> >> > > >> > > > > > >
> >> > > >> > > > > > >
> >> > > >> > > > > >
> >> > > >> > > > >
> >> > > >> > > >
> >> > > >> > >
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >
> >> > > >
> >> > > >
> >> > > >--
> >> > > >Victor Adrian Sosa Herrera
> >> > > >IBM Software Engineer
> >> > > >Guadalajara, Jalisco
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >>---------------------------------------------------------------------
> >> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@cordova.apache.org
> >> > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@cordova.apache.org
> >> > >
> >> >
> >>
>
>

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