cordova-dev mailing list archives

Site index · List index
Message view « Date » · « Thread »
Top « Date » · « Thread »
From Brian LeRoux...@brian.io>
Subject Re: Independent platform release summary
Date Fri, 10 Oct 2014 17:05:08 GMT
OR we move to named releases externally.

Cordova MX === 4.0
On Oct 10, 2014 10:03 AM, "Michal Mocny" <mmocny@chromium.org> wrote:

> 4 was also discussed as fine, and in isolation would have been our choice
> for sure -- but we worried that with the impending "cordova-4.0" releases,
> it would confuse users and not mark a clear departure from cadver.
>
> The more I think about it though, the less important I think that worry
> is.  Maybe 4.0 is fine.
>
> (Apologies to Steve, who just wants to get this over with)
>
> On Fri, Oct 10, 2014 at 12:48 PM, Brian LeRoux <b@brian.io> wrote:
>
> > As is 4.
> >
> > This is more of an outreach, marketing, blogging, tweeting, etc problem.
> > Versions are for issue tracking not marketing. (Tho semver and our
> > respective $BIGCO's confuse that to their and our continued strife.)
> >
> > (All IMO of course, happy to follow the wisdom of the crowd on this one.)
> > On Oct 10, 2014 9:29 AM, "Michal Mocny" <mmocny@chromium.org> wrote:
> >
> > > 5 is also fine.
> > >
> > > On Fri, Oct 10, 2014 at 12:17 PM, Brian LeRoux <b@brian.io> wrote:
> > >
> > > > I am against it. Its not going to achieve the goal of alleviating
> > > > confusion. People see the CLI as the version not the platforms. I'd
> > > rather
> > > > we went to 5 if anything.
> > > > On Oct 9, 2014 3:56 PM, "Parashuram Narasimhan (MS OPEN TECH)" <
> > > > panarasi@microsoft.com> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > I meant tag and start the vote for the next release :)
> > > > >
> > > > > On 10/9/14, 3:01 PM, "Chuck Lantz" <clantz@microsoft.com> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > >+1
> > > > > >
> > > > > >-Chuck
> > > > > >
> > > > > >-----Original Message-----
> > > > > >From: Jesse [mailto:purplecabbage@gmail.com]
> > > > > >Sent: Thursday, October 9, 2014 2:55 PM
> > > > > >To: dev@cordova.apache.org
> > > > > >Subject: Re: Independent platform release summary
> > > > > >
> > > > > >+1 to not voting ;) , it implies we will wait 72 hours before
> moving
> > > on.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >How about if anyone is completely against 10.0.0 they voice it
> here,
> > > in
> > > > > >the next couple hours, otherwise we move forward.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >@purplecabbage
> > > > > >risingj.com
> > > > > >
> > > > > >On Thu, Oct 9, 2014 at 2:52 PM, Steven Gill <
> stevengill97@gmail.com
> > >
> > > > > >wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > >> I don't think a vote is necessary. I'd hate to see us resort
to
> > > voting
> > > > > >> to solve problems. Voting should be a last resort if consensus
> is
> > > > > >> split. I don't see that in this scenario.
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> I propose we bumb the version up to 10.0.0.
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> On Thu, Oct 9, 2014 at 2:45 PM, Parashuram Narasimhan (MS
OPEN
> > > TECH) <
> > > > > >> panarasi@microsoft.com> wrote:
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> > Lets start with a vote for 10.0.0 ? And if someone
feels
> > strongly
> > > > > >> > about calling it something the vote could be cancelled
!!
> > > > > >> >
> > > > > >> > On 10/9/14, 2:41 PM, "Chuck Lantz" <clantz@microsoft.com>
> > wrote:
> > > > > >> >
> > > > > >> > >Yeah agreed - Vladimir squashed the bug and what
was at once
> > > point
> > > > > >> > >to be called 3.7.0 has been mainly waiting on a
version
> number.
> > > > > >> > >Personally I am fine with 10.0.0 or 5.0.0 - Either
send the
> > > message
> > > > > >> > >that platform versions are divorced from the CLI
from a
> > > versioning
> > > > > >> > >perspective (though behavior is still predictable).
 Leo - I
> > > think
> > > > > >> > >at least out of the gate devs will likely focus
on the CLI
> > > version
> > > > > >> > >as primary.  Basically today, the cadence version
of the CLI
> is
> > > > > >> > >what people talk about.  Heck, Cordova
> > > > > >> > >3.4.1 was 3.4.0 for all platforms but iOS.  The
main message
> is
> > > > > >> > >that
> > > > > >> when
> > > > > >> > >you platform add android, you may see an npm pull
for
> > > > > >> > >cordova-android@4.3.2 and that is expected.  It's
just
> > > formalizing
> > > > > >> > >the message and allows independent platform rev'ing.
> > > > > >> > >
> > > > > >> > >-Chuck
> > > > > >> > >
> > > > > >> > >-----Original Message-----
> > > > > >> > >From: Steven Gill [mailto:stevengill97@gmail.com]
> > > > > >> > >Sent: Thursday, October 9, 2014 2:13 PM
> > > > > >> > >To: dev@cordova.apache.org
> > > > > >> > >Cc: Michal Mocny; Marcel Kinard
> > > > > >> > >Subject: Re: Independent platform release summary
> > > > > >> > >
> > > > > >> > >I think vladimir fixed the bug. We just need to
release now.
> > > > > >> > >
> > > > > >> > >Only thing holding back the release now is consensus
on the
> > > version
> > > > > >> > >of the cli. It seemed like most people were leaning
toward
> > > 10.0.0.
> > > > > >> > >Should I move forward with that? I would just have
to branch
> +
> > > pin
> > > > > >> > >deps
> > > > > >> > >
> > > > > >> > >Leo the documentation version dropdown box would
be tied to
> cli
> > > > > >>version.
> > > > > >> > >It still makes sense to copy over platform documentation
into
> > > > > >> > >platform repos and maybe copy it into docs during
generation
> > > time.
> > > > > >> > >
> > > > > >> > >As for plugin pinning, plugins have more to do
with
> platforms.
> > I
> > > > > >> wouldn't
> > > > > >> > >say they aren't tied to the cli at all. I understand
your
> point
> > > > > >>though.
> > > > > >> > >So far, we haven't had any plugins that won't work
with
> > previous
> > > > > >> versions
> > > > > >> > >(As far as I know). We should really fix the engine
stuff for
> > > > > >> > >plugins so we can keep track of what platforms
they work for.
> > I'd
> > > > > >> > >like us to give warnings to users to update their
plugins if
> > > newer
> > > > > >>versions are out.
> > > > > >> > >Cordova info should also dump what versions of
plugins you
> have
> > > > > >> installed
> > > > > >> > >if it doesn't already. In combination with cordova
--save &
> > > cordova
> > > > > >> > >--restore, we should be able to recommend a workflow
that is
> > > easily
> > > > > >> > >reproducible on any machine.
> > > > > >> > >
> > > > > >> > >On Thu, Oct 9, 2014 at 1:44 PM, Chuck Lantz <
> > > clantz@microsoft.com>
> > > > > >> wrote:
> > > > > >> > >
> > > > > >> > >> Okay - so - there's a pretty nasty CLI blocker
bug right
> now.
> > > > > >> > >> Plugins with dependencies don't install (this
affects all
> > > > > >> > >> platforms).  In my opinion, we need to get
a CLI release
> out
> > > > > >> > >> really soon.  Are we closed on this topic,
or do we need to
> > > look
> > > > > >> > >> at doing the old process to get this out the
door while we
> > are
> > > > > >>still talking?
> > > > > >> > >>
> > > > > >> > >> There are also a series of other bugs in the
currently
> tagged
> > > > > >>"3.6.4"
> > > > > >> > >> platforms for Android, Windows, and Windows
Phone 8.  These
> > can
> > > > > >> > >> be handled independently, but the CLI bug
can't.
> > > > > >> > >>
> > > > > >> > >> https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/CB-7670
> > > > > >> > >>
> > > > > >> > >> -Chuck
> > > > > >> > >>
> > > > > >> > >> -----Original Message-----
> > > > > >> > >> From: Treggiari, Leo [mailto:leo.treggiari@intel.com]
> > > > > >> > >> Sent: Thursday, October 9, 2014 12:23 PM
> > > > > >> > >> To: Michal Mocny
> > > > > >> > >> Cc: Marcel Kinard; dev
> > > > > >> > >> Subject: RE: Independent platform release
summary
> > > > > >> > >>
> > > > > >> > >> I'll have to admit that this seems a bit weird.
 That is,
> > > > > >> > >> independent versions of the CLI and platforms,
with a
> > "Cordova
> > > > > >> > >> release" named "something" - e.g. a date?
> > > > > >> > >>
> > > > > >> > >> Imagine a user wants to know whether the new
whitelist
> entry
> > in
> > > > > >> > >> config.xml is supported in the versions of
CLI and
> platforms
> > > that
> > > > > >> > >> they have - assuming they understand the distinction
> between
> > > the
> > > > > >> > >> CLI and platforms to begin with.  They use
some command to
> > list
> > > > > >> > >> the versions of the "things" (CLI and
> > > > > >> > >> platforms) they have installed.  They go to
the individual
> > > > > >> > >> documentation of the "things" and try to figure
it out.
> > > > > >> > >>
> > > > > >> > >> The way the Cordova documentation works today
is nice with
> > the
> > > > > >> > >> combo box where I can select a Cordova version
- 3.6.0,
> > 3.5.0,
> > > > > >> > >> ...  What would the combo box contain in the
new versioning
> > > > > >> > >> scheme and how many entries would there be?
 Are the
> answers
> > > > > >>"dates" and "lots of dates"?
> > > > > >> > >> Or would there be no Cordova version documentation
other
> than
> > > an
> > > > > >> > >> explanation of how to get the list of "things"
you
> currently
> > > have
> > > > > >> > >> and where to find the documentation on them.
> > > > > >> > >>
> > > > > >> > >> To "pin" or not to "pin.
> > > > > >> > >>
> > > > > >> > >> Note that, to me, the pinning choice defines
what happens
> > when
> > > I
> > > > > >> > >>use  "cordova {plugin | platform} add foo"
with no specific
> > > > > >> > >>version specified.
> > > > > >> > >>
> > > > > >> > >> I've understood, so far at least, that plugins
are not
> pinned
> > > (an
> > > > > >> > >> add always fetches something) and platforms
are pinned to a
> > CLI
> > > > > >> > >> version (an add tells the CLI that I will
be using that
> > > platform
> > > > > >> > >> (already
> > > > > >> > >> installed) for this project).  Everything
I have read which
> > > > > >> > >> includes 1 book and the on-line project documentation,
> > suggest
> > > > > >> > >> that, even if not stating it explicitly. 
E.g. plugins talk
> > > about
> > > > > >> > >> "fetching" and platforms don't.  There is
a way to fetch a
> > > > > >> > >> specific version of platform support.  That's
good and if I
> > do
> > > > > >> > >> that it is up to me to understand the compatibility
of the
> > > > > >>specific version I requested.
> > > > > >> > >>
> > > > > >> > >> Is this true?  If so then the npm cordova
behavior seems
> > weird.
> > > > > >> > >> That is, if I "npm install cordova" I get
a set of pinned
> > > > > >> > >> platforms.  If I "npm update cordova", I get
a new CLI and
> > > > > >> > >> nothing else - i.e. not the platforms that
were pinned to
> > that
> > > > > >>version of the CLI?
> > > > > >> > >>
> > > > > >> > >> Should the plugin and platform 'pin' behavior
be the same?
> > > > > >> > >>
> > > > > >> > >> Should both be pinned?  Some may find this
alternative
> > > > > >>"blasphemous"
> > > > > >> > >> but the core plugin versions tested with a
version of the
> CLI
> > > > > >> > >> could be pinned to the version of the CLI.
> > > > > >> > >>
> > > > > >> > >> Should both not be pinned?  It would be more
consistent and
> > if
> > > > > >> > >> users are OK with plugins being unpinned,
why not
> platforms?
> > > > > >> > >>
> > > > > >> > >> But maybe plugins and platforms are different.
 Plugins are
> > > > > >> > >> purely run-time code.  Platforms are primarily
tooling with
> > > some
> > > > > >> > >> run-time
> > > > > >> code.
> > > > > >> > >> Does that difference make the current pinning
behavior the
> > best
> > > > > >> choice.
> > > > > >> > >>
> > > > > >> > >> Maybe, but personally I would prefer both
to be pinned -
> > i.e. I
> > > > > >> > >> install a version of Cordova, and until I
update it, every
> > > time I
> > > > > >> > >> add a platform or 'core' plugin, I get the
same thing.
> > > > > >> > >>
> > > > > >> > >> Leo
> > > > > >> > >>
> > > > > >> > >> From: mmocny@google.com [mailto:mmocny@google.com]
On
> Behalf
> > > Of
> > > > > >> Michal
> > > > > >> > >> Mocny
> > > > > >> > >> Sent: Wednesday, October 08, 2014 1:47 PM
> > > > > >> > >> To: Treggiari, Leo
> > > > > >> > >> Cc: Michal Mocny; Marcel Kinard; dev
> > > > > >> > >> Subject: Re: Independent platform release
summary
> > > > > >> > >>
> > > > > >> > >> With this direction, there is no single number.
 Users
> should
> > > not
> > > > > >> > >> functionally care about CLI version, so there
will just be
> > the
> > > > > >> > >> platform versions that matter, really.
> > > > > >> > >>
> > > > > >> > >> Downstreams can of course put labels on combinations
of
> > > versions,
> > > > > >> > >> so "PhoneGap 4" may be Android 4, iOS 3.8,
and etc.
> > > > > >> > >>
> > > > > >> > >> On Wed, Oct 8, 2014 at 4:39 PM, Treggiari,
Leo
> > > > > >> > >> <leo.treggiari@intel.com <mailto:leo.treggiari@intel.com>>
> > > > wrote:
> > > > > >> > >> > Did I miss anything?
> > > > > >> > >>
> > > > > >> > >> I don't think we closed on this (I had to
leave the
> meeting a
> > > > > >> > >> little
> > > > > >> > >> early) but a remaining question is how to
version what we
> > (and
> > > > > >> > >> users) call "Cordova".  Assuming a "Cordova"
version is a
> > point
> > > > > >> > >> in time collection of the latest CLI version
+ platform
> > > versions
> > > > > >> > >> + plugin versions.  Is the Cordova version
semver (using
> what
> > > > > >> > >> algorithm with respect to its contained
> > > > > >> > >> components) or is that what you meant by 
""latest as of
> Oct
> > > > > >> > >> 2014" or something".
> > > > > >> > >>
> > > > > >> > >> Thanks,
> > > > > >> > >> Leo
> > > > > >> > >>
> > > > > >> > >> -----Original Message-----
> > > > > >> > >> From: mmocny@google.com<mailto:mmocny@google.com>
[mailto:
> > > > > >> > >> mmocny@google.com<mailto:mmocny@google.com>]
On Behalf Of
> > > Michal
> > > > > >> Mocny
> > > > > >> > >> Sent: Wednesday, October 08, 2014 1:13 PM
> > > > > >> > >> To: Michal Mocny
> > > > > >> > >> Cc: Marcel Kinard; dev
> > > > > >> > >> Subject: Re: Independent platform release
summary Thanks
> > > everyone
> > > > > >> > >> for participation in what was a long and grueling
> discussion.
> > > > > >> > >>
> > > > > >> > >> Summary of current proposal:
> > > > > >> > >> - Cad-ver is dead.
> > > > > >> > >> - Everything moves Sem-ver, with platforms
continuing from
> > > > > >> > >> current versions and diverging over time.
> > > > > >> > >> - CLI potentially gets a significant version
bump to
> showcase
> > > > > >> > >> this reset (to 5.0 or 10.0, not yet settled)
> > > > > >> > >> - Pinning default platform versions *will*
continue for the
> > > time
> > > > > >> > >> being, but it will be trivial to override
the default.
> > > > > >> > >> - Platforms will have CLI <engine> tag
equivalent (unclear
> > yet
> > > if
> > > > > >> > >> as node peerDependency or otherwise) so devs
will know when
> > > they
> > > > > >> > >> need to upgrade/downgrade CLI for non-default
platform
> > > versions.
> > > > > >> > >> - After a platform update, eventually CLI
will release to
> > "pin"
> > > > > >> > >> the new default, and bump its PATCH/MINOR
version (unless
> CLI
> > > had
> > > > > >> > >> a functional update at same time that requires
a larger
> > bump).
> > > > > >> > >> - After you update CLI, your existing projects
don't
> change &
> > > > > >> > >> platform upgrades remain explicit, but you
will now get
> > > warnings
> > > > > >> > >> if your installed platforms are older than
the CLI pinned
> > > > versions.
> > > > > >> > >> - Event MAJOR changes to platforms are not
MAJOR updates to
> > the
> > > > > >> > >> CLI, unless there is an actual breaking change
to the CLI
> > tool
> > > > > >> > >> (i.e. new CLI will no longer work with the
currently
> > installed
> > > > > >>platform).
> > > > > >> > >> - Platform and CLI docs have to split out
and be released &
> > > > > >> > >> versioned alongside each (like plugins). 
Cross references
> > from
> > > > > >> > >> one to the other will only be needed in a
few places.
> > > > > >> > >>
> > > > > >> > >>
> > > > > >> > >> Note: The CLI-Platform compatibility story
is functionally
> no
> > > > > >> > >>different than we have today.  If you upgrade
your CLI and
> > there
> > > > > >> > >>is a  breaking change, you will have to re-create
your
> > projects
> > > or
> > > > > >> > >>downgrade CLI again.
> > > > > >> > >> Now we plan to be more explicit about it and
offer
> warnings.
> > > > > >> > >>
> > > > > >> > >> Note: There is no concept of a "fancy-pants"
release other
> > than
> > > > > >> > >> to say "latest as of Oct 2014" or something.
 Platforms
> don't
> > > > > >> > >> have a single common set of functionality,
so CadVer was
> > > somewhat
> > > > > >> > >> misleading already in that sense.  We could
introduce a
> > concept
> > > > > >> > >> of "API Level" for exec bridge or something
for use by
> > plugins,
> > > > > >>but not sure that has value.
> > > > > >> > >>
> > > > > >> > >>
> > > > > >> > >> What wasn't covered that came to mind after
the fact:
> > > > > >> > >> - When there is an update available for CLI,
should we
> give a
> > > > > >> > >> warning to update? (this is useful, but isn't
common for
> npm
> > > > > >> > >> modules.  I think we already do this from
plugman when you
> > try
> > > to
> > > > > >>publish plugins?).
> > > > > >> > >>
> > > > > >> > >>
> > > > > >> > >> Did I miss anything?
> > > > > >> > >>
> > > > > >> > >> -Michal
> > > > > >> > >>
> > > > > >> > >> On Wed, Oct 8, 2014 at 12:35 PM, Michal Mocny
> > > > > >> > >><mmocny@chromium.org<mailto:
> > > > > >> > >> mmocny@chromium.org>> wrote:
> > > > > >> > >>
> > > > > >> > >> > External Public link for those that just
want to
> > watch/chat:
> > > > > >> > >> >
> https://plus.google.com/events/cm4l0vifcig920qkhpn5stqiet4
> > > > > >> > >> >
> > > > > >> > >> > Hangout link to join the conversation:
> > > > > >> > >> >
> > > > > >>
> > > https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYcNwXEyet4Xv_23HiTl
> > > > > >> > >> > 4I K0jsM4NlmGy5kbLsPIW3SnOsUEIQ?authuser=0&hl=en
> > > > > >> > >> >
> > > > > >> > >> > See you in 30 minutes.
> > > > > >> > >> >
> > > > > >> > >> > On Wed, Oct 8, 2014 at 12:33 PM, Michal
Mocny
> > > > > >> > >> > <mmocny@chromium.org
> > > > > >> > >> <mailto:mmocny@chromium.org>> wrote:
> > > > > >> > >> >
> > > > > >> > >> >> +dev list again
> > > > > >> > >> >>
> > > > > >> > >> >> Not everyone could make 1pm, not
everyone could make
> 2pm.
> > > > > >> > >> >> While I don't think we need a full
2 hours, I'm hoping
> to
> > > > > >> > >> >> start late and end early -- proving
opportunity people
> to
> > > pop
> > > > > >> > >> >> in at either time and chime
> > > > > >> > >> in.
> > > > > >> > >> >>
> > > > > >> > >> >> On Wed, Oct 8, 2014 at 12:18 PM,
Marcel Kinard
> > > > > >> > >> >> <cmarcelk@gmail.com<mailto:cmarcelk@gmail.com>>
> > > > > >> > >> >> wrote:
> > > > > >> > >> >>
> > > > > >> > >> >>> Is the expected duration 1 hour
or 2 hours?
> > > > > >> > >> >>>
> > > > > >> > >> >>> On Oct 8, 2014, at 10:56 AM,
Michal Mocny
> > > > > >> > >><mmocny@chromium.org<mailto:
> > > > > >> > >> mmocny@chromium.org>> wrote:
> > > > > >> > >> >>>
> > > > > >> > >> >>> > So it looks like Today 1-3
EST or Friday 1-3 EST are
> > the
> > > > > >> > >> >>> > best
> > > > > >> > >>times.
> > > > > >> > >> >>> I'm
> > > > > >> > >> >>> > going to start the ball
rolling to do this TODAY, but
> > if
> > > > > >> > >> >>> > that proves
> > > > > >> > >> >>> too
> > > > > >> > >> >>> > short notices we'll move
it to Friday.
> > > > > >> > >> >>> >
> > > > > >> > >> >>> > I'll email out links to
hangout at 12:30 or so, and
> I'm
> > > > > >> > >> >>> > hoping Steven
> > > > > >> > >> >>> can
> > > > > >> > >> >>> > make it before 2pm since
he's been most active with
> > > > > >> > >> >>> > releases
> > > > > >> > >> recently.
> > > > > >> > >> >>> >
> > > > > >> > >> >>> > -Michal
> > > > > >> > >> >>>
> > > > > >> > >> >>>
> > > > > >> > >> >>
> > > > > >> > >> >
> > > > > >> > >>
> > > > > >> > >>
> > > > > >> > >
> > > > > >> >
> > > >-------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > >> > >-- To unsubscribe, e-mail:
> dev-unsubscribe@cordova.apache.org
> > > > > >> > >For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@cordova.apache.org
> > > > > >> > >
> > > > > >> >
> > > > > >> >
> > > > > >> >
> > > --------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > >> > - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@cordova.apache.org
> > > > > >> > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@cordova.apache.org
> > > > > >> >
> > > > > >> >
> > > > > >>
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> >?B�KKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKCB�
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> >?�?[��X��ܚX�K??K[XZ[?�??]�][��X��ܚX�P?�ܙ?ݘK�\?X�?K�ܙ�B��܈?Y??]?[ۘ[??��[X[�
> > > > > >?�??K[XZ[?�??]�Z?[???�ܙ?ݘK�\?X�?K�ܙ�B
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
>

Mime
  • Unnamed multipart/alternative (inline, None, 0 bytes)
View raw message