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From Shane Curcuru <...@shanecurcuru.org>
Subject Re: Apache Cordova "Translated using Microsoft Bing Translation"...
Date Thu, 05 Jun 2014 20:37:38 GMT
(Note mixed public/private lists)

It depends.  What specific authorization is Microsoft looking for?

As a public charity, we are happy to have respectful third parties like 
Microsoft use our product logos to refer to our products in a wide 
variety of places.  We are even happy to have third parties build 
solutions atop our software, and then in some specific ways incorporate 
our product names into their product names (Powered By, etc.). 
Similarly, we're happy for third parties to describe how they use our 
products in various ways - we are far more liberal here and don't 
require explicit permissions for many of these things, which is very 
different from the average software vendor.

But as a independent home for projects that often attract contributions 
from many different sources, we need to ensure that our brands are not 
used in ways that would serve to endorse a third party, or to promote 
any specific affiliation with third parties that would harm our 
projects' abilities to manage their governance independently of 
corporate influence, and to attract new contributors.

We have strong draft guidelines for the flip side of this question, 
which merely need a bit more explanation before I update to best 
practices and push out - to give a flavor of the issues we should 
consider here:

   http://www.apache.org/foundation/marks/linking

In general I would be fine with the translation team at Microsoft saying 
"we've donated services to these open source projects:" in a 
presentation or webpage where you list a variety of project names or 
logos.  That's an appropriate factual reference, and makes the 
relationship clear.  But I'm probably not fine with that team saying 
"We're the best machine translators since Apache Cordova uses us!"

Does that help?  If not, can you be more specific as to what uses of 
Apache brands you're looking for?  My guess is that any uses you believe 
are respectful of the independent governance model that is a key part of 
the Apache brand would be fine - but it's difficult to say that without 
understanding the likely uses.

Separately, Gianugo and Ross both are long time Apache Members who I 
know can provide the right kind of feedback to new ideas you might want 
to get a gut check on first.

Also, if you do have feedback or additional questions, we'd appreciate 
them on trademarks@ so we can start to provide better up-front 
documentation about our expectations.  It takes some time to write clear 
situations, but there are plenty of respectful uses of Apache brands 
that we want to promote, and don't need to require specific approvals of 
in each case.

- Shane Curcuru
   VP, Brand Management
   The Apache Software Foundation


On 6/5/14 8:00 AM, Lisa Seacat DeLuca wrote:> Just following up on this. 
  I haven't heard anyone from the Apache
 > trademarks team chime in with this new updated request.  Please let me
 > know if there are any problems so I know whether I can move forward
 > working with Microsoft on enhancing our translation efforts for Apache
 > Cordova.
 >
 > Thanks,
 >
 >
 > Lisa
...
 > From: Ross Gardler <rgardler@opendirective.com>
 > To: "dev@cordova.apache.org" <dev@cordova.apache.org>
 > Cc: Lisa Seacat DeLuca/San Francisco/IBM@IBMUS, "Ross Gardler (MS OPEN
 > TECH)" <Ross.Gardler@microsoft.com>, "Olivier Bloch (MS OPEN TECH)"
 > <obloch@microsoft.com>, Apache Brand Management <trademarks@apache.org>,
 > "Gianugo Rabellino (MS OPEN TECH)" <Gianugo.Rabellino@microsoft.com>
 > Date: 05/30/2014 08:19 PM
 > Subject: Re: Apache Cordova "Translated using Microsoft Bing
 > Translation"...
...
 > Olivier,
 >
 > The ASF cannot grant open ended authorization for the trademarks. 
However,
 > as long as a) the Cordova PMC are comfortable with the proposed use 
and b)
 > it confirmed with the ASF trademark policy then there should be no 
problem
 > with this.
 >
 > So, for example, approval to use the Cordova logo in case study should be
 > fine. Reuse of the logo when presenting that case study should be fine
 > (again, assuming conformance with the ASF trademark policy).
 >
 >
 > On Fri, May 30, 2014 at 14:40 PM, Olivier Fontana 
<olivierf@microsoft.com>
 > wrote:
...
 > Hi Cordova team,
 >
 >
 >
 > In view of the limited volume requested we will waive the clause 
regarding
 > the use of the translation.
 >
 >
 >
 > Therefore, the only requirements will be, as per our email exchange with
 > Lisa:
 >
 > -
 > Attribution to the Microsoft Translator brand as per the description on
 > www.microsoft.com/Translatorin the "Attribution"
 > menu
 >
 > -
 > Apache Cordova team will provide Microsoft with the authorization to use
 > their logo as well as short text/sentence from their choosing that we 
will
 > be able to use for our marketing: website, customer presentations, etc.
 >
 >
 >
 > Are we OK with this?
 >
 >
 >
 > Thank you,
 >
 >
 >
 > Olivier
 >
 >
 >
 >
 >
 >
 >
 > <http://www.microsoft.com/translator/>
 >
 >
 >
 > Olivier Fontana, Director of Product Marketing, Microsoft Translator
 >
 > (t) +1 (425) 705-6555 | (m) +1 (425) 246-3128 |
 > olivierf@microsoft.com 
<javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','alias@microsoft.com');>
 >
 > www.microsoft.com/translator
 >
 >
 >
 >
 >
 >
 >
 >
 >
 > [image: cid:image002.png@01CF4F32.60A85F40]
 > <https://www.facebook.com/bingtranslator>
 > <http://ww.twitter.com/mstranslator> 
<http://blogs.msdn.com/translation>
 >
 >
 >
 >
 >
 >
 >
 >
 >
 > *From:* Lisa Seacat DeLuca [mailto:ldeluca@us.ibm.com
 > <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','ldeluca@us.ibm.com');>]
 >
 > *Sent:* Thursday, May 29, 2014 13:41
 > *To:* dev@cordova.apache.org
 > <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','dev@cordova.apache.org');>
 > *Cc:* Ross Gardler (MS OPEN TECH); Apache Brand Management; Olivier 
Fontana
 > *Subject:* Re: Apache Cordova "Translated using Microsoft Bing
 > Translation"...
 >
 >
 >
 > "Are we sure that we can use the machine translation from an IP
 > perspective? "
 >
 >
 > Yes, I spoke to Olivier Fontana (added to the CC list) who is the 
Director
 > of Product Strategy and Marketing, Machine Translation group, at 
Microsoft
 > Research about whether or not there were any
 > licensing concerns with the output of the documentation that went through
 > the Machine Translation tool and he said there was not an issue and 
that we
 > would still "own the content" as long as we didn't take the result to 
build
 > our own language model that might
 > be used as a competitor to Microsoft's machine translation service... 
which
 > we do not intend to do.
 >
 >
 >
 >
 > Lisa Seacat DeLuca
 > Mobile Engineer | t: +415.787.4589 | ldeluca@apache.org | |
 > ldeluca@us.ibm.com |
 > lisaseacat.com <http://www.lisaseacat.com/> | [image: follow 
@LisaSeacat on
 > twitter] <http://www.twitter.com/LisaSeacat>|
 > [image: follow Lisa Seacat DeLuca on linkedin]
 > <http://www.linkedin.com/in/lisaseacat>
 >
 >
 >
 >
 > From:        David Nalley <david@gnsa.us>
 >
 > To:        Apache Brand Management <trademarks@apache.org>
 >
 > Cc:        Cordova Dev <dev@cordova.apache.org>, Ross Gardler <
 > Ross.Gardler@microsoft.com>
 >
 > Date:        05/29/2014 04:15 PM
 >
 > Subject:        Re: Apache Cordova "Translated using Microsoft Bing
 > Translation"...
 >
 >
 > ------------------------------
 >
 >
 >
 >
 >
 >
 >
 >
 > On Thu, May 29, 2014 at 1:44 PM, Lisa Seacat DeLuca <ldeluca@us.ibm.com>
 > wrote:
 >
 > Cordova/Apache Team~
 >
 > As many of you are aware, we are using Crowdin to translate our
 > documentation into multiple languages.  When we are nearly 100% 
translated
 > we utilize some machine translation within the crowdin tool to finish off
 > the translations.  Currently we are using the
 > free level within Microsoft Translator service which includes 2 Million
 > characters a month.  As we add support for additional languages and 
provide
 > translations across the multiple platforms and plugins we quickly hit 
that
 > 2 million character limit.  I have
 > spoken with the Microsoft Translator team and they have graciously agreed
 > to support our project by providing us with the 64M character level a 
month
 > at no cost.  In return, they ask that we acknowledge the use of Microsoft
 > Translator for our translations.
 >
 >
 > *I'm writing to see if anyone sees any reason why this*
 >
 >
 >
 >
 >
 > --
 > Sent from MetroMail
 >



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