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From Steven Gill <stevengil...@gmail.com>
Subject Re: config.xml discussion, we need to talk
Date Fri, 18 Oct 2013 22:21:19 GMT
Brian suggested Project Development (CLI workflow) vs Platform Development
(bin/scripts)


On Fri, Oct 18, 2013 at 3:09 PM, Steven Gill <stevengill97@gmail.com> wrote:

> We need more suggestions!
>
> Anis suggested picking to arbitrary names that don't reflect the workflows
> but would be easy to refer to.
>
>
>
>
> On Fri, Oct 18, 2013 at 12:41 PM, Michal Mocny <mmocny@chromium.org>wrote:
>
>> I use the IDE with the CLI and hope to make it better.
>>
>> In my mind, the old way is for making platform modifications, and the new
>> way threads platforms/ as a build artifact.
>>
>> If you must control the platform code, you sacrifice easy upgrades and
>> ease
>> of multi-platform development, but gain control.
>> If you want to use the CLI, you lose the ability to make modifications to
>> directly platform code without worrying about the implications.
>>
>> -Michal
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Oct 18, 2013 at 3:18 PM, Steven Gill <stevengill97@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> > I like that better.
>> >
>> > I know that both methods use the command line, but the cordova-cli has
>> cli
>> > in its name! We call the tool the cordova-cli so it might be more
>> confusing
>> > going away from that and calling it anything else. Not saying we
>> shouldn't
>> > be open to a name change though just because we called it X since its
>> > inception (or am I saying that? :P).
>> >
>> > When we write the docs about the other workflow (bin/create, plugman),
>> > maybe making the IDE an integral part of it would make it make more
>> sense
>> > calling that workflow IDE. Just a thought.
>> >
>> >
>> > On Fri, Oct 18, 2013 at 12:09 PM, Jesse <purplecabbage@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> >
>> > >  IDE or cordova-cli ??
>> > >
>> > > @purplecabbage
>> > > risingj.com
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > On Fri, Oct 18, 2013 at 12:02 PM, Steven Gill <stevengill97@gmail.com
>> > > >wrote:
>> > >
>> > > > I think SinplePlatform vs MultiPlatform is misleading because you
>> can
>> > use
>> > > > the CLI to do single platform development.
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > On Fri, Oct 18, 2013 at 11:51 AM, Jesse <purplecabbage@gmail.com>
>> > wrote:
>> > > >
>> > > > > SinglePlatform vs MultiPlatform makes the most sense to me.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > SinglePlatform = Focus on a single platform, and use plugman
and
>> the
>> > > > > platform scripts directly. Useful when you only have that
>> particular
>> > > > device
>> > > > > to test on, or only have access to that device's marketplace.
>>  Also
>> > > > useful
>> > > > > for platform developers who are focused primarily on the native
>> code.
>> > > > > ( aka DivideAndConquer )
>> > > > >
>> > > > > MultiPlatform = Build your app for a bunch of platforms at the
>> same
>> > > time.
>> > > > > Great for when you know you are targeting multiple stores/devices.
>> > > > > ( aka DucksInARow or MagicBullet )
>> > > > >
>> > > > > I tend to lean towards the SinglePlatform, so maybe someone else
>> > could
>> > > > > enumerate more Multi benefits.
>> > > > >
>> > > > >
>> > > > > @purplecabbage
>> > > > > risingj.com
>> > > > >
>> > > > >
>> > > > > On Fri, Oct 18, 2013 at 11:28 AM, Steven Gill <
>> > stevengill97@gmail.com
>> > > > > >wrote:
>> > > > >
>> > > > > > John: If you decided to take a stab a blogging about it,
please
>> > think
>> > > > > about
>> > > > > > blogging on the cordova site! We can all review it before
>> > publishing
>> > > it
>> > > > > > too!
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > Erik: that video was awesome! Let me know when Gorkem does
a
>> > release
>> > > > and
>> > > > > I
>> > > > > > can post it on the cordova twitter feed.
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > Michal: Could just be CLI vs Plugman workflow
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > On Fri, Oct 18, 2013 at 10:21 AM, Michal Mocny <
>> > mmocny@chromium.org>
>> > > > > > wrote:
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > > I wonder if we should not work out better names for
the two
>> > > > workflows.
>> > > > > > >  Both are kinda command-line-based so saying "CLI"
vs "old" is
>> > > > > confusing.
>> > > > > > >  As is saying "the bin/ script flow" confusing.  Not
sure if
>> > > "multi"
>> > > > vs
>> > > > > > > "single" platform flow is any better, since you can
use both
>> > flows
>> > > > for
>> > > > > > one
>> > > > > > > or more platforms.
>> > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > Anyway, if we have more obvious/catchy names, then
we can be
>> more
>> > > > clear
>> > > > > > in
>> > > > > > > our communications which flow our answers are relevant
to.
>>  i.e.,
>> > > > "use
>> > > > > > > plugman to ... (only for ___ flow)".  i.e., "Be carefully
when
>> > > > editing
>> > > > > in
>> > > > > > > IDE ... (only for ___ flow)".
>> > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > -Michal
>> > > > > > >
>> > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > On Fri, Oct 18, 2013 at 1:14 PM, Anis KADRI <
>> > anis.kadri@gmail.com>
>> > > > > > wrote:
>> > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > > Erik that's great! Where can we download it?
>> > > > > > > > On Oct 18, 2013 8:01 AM, "Andrew Grieve" <
>> agrieve@chromium.org
>> > >
>> > > > > wrote:
>> > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > > > Awesome video!!
>> > > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > > > On Fri, Oct 18, 2013 at 3:43 AM, Erik Jan
de Wit <
>> > > > > edewit@redhat.com>
>> > > > > > > > > wrote:
>> > > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > > > > On the topic of IDE support my collage
Gorkem has made a
>> > nice
>> > > > > > wizard
>> > > > > > > in
>> > > > > > > > > > eclipse that mimics the CLI have a look
at this video
>> > > > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > > > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QUyUUtmTYok
>> > > > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > > > > On 18 Oct,2013, at 4:29 , Maxime LUCE
<
>> Maxime@somatic.fr>
>> > > > wrote:
>> > > > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > > > > > Great Bryan
>> > > > > > > > > > > Totally agree !!!
>> > > > > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > > > > > Cordialement.
>> > > > > > > > > > > -------------------------------
>> > > > > > > > > > > Maxime LUCE - Somatic
>> > > > > > > > > > > maxime.luce@somatic.fr
>> > > > > > > > > > > 06 28 60 72 34
>> > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________
>> > > > > > > > > > > De : Brian LeRoux<mailto:b@brian.io>
>> > > > > > > > > > > Envoyé : 18/10/2013 01:48
>> > > > > > > > > > > À : dev@cordova.apache.org<mailto:
>> dev@cordova.apache.org
>> > >
>> > > > > > > > > > > Objet : Re: config.xml discussion,
we need to talk
>> > > > > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > > > > > I don't really appreciate comments
that we don't talk
>> to
>> > > our
>> > > > > > users,
>> > > > > > > > or
>> > > > > > > > > > build apps in anger. Neither of those
assertions are
>> true.
>> > > The
>> > > > > > > origins
>> > > > > > > > of
>> > > > > > > > > > these initiatives are based on both
community feedback,
>> and
>> > > > > direct
>> > > > > > > > > > experience.
>> > > > > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > > > > > Keeping your focus on just pure
platform side of a
>> > project
>> > > is
>> > > > > > fine,
>> > > > > > > > of
>> > > > > > > > > > course, since the CLI delegates to the
platform. This
>> was
>> > > also
>> > > > a
>> > > > > > > > > deliberate
>> > > > > > > > > > learning from MANY attempts at an architecture
that
>> > satisfies
>> > > > > both
>> > > > > > > > > > approaches. It separates the concerns
and respects the
>> > > platform
>> > > > > > will
>> > > > > > > be
>> > > > > > > > > > canonical for the common workflows supported.
This is a
>> > very
>> > > > real
>> > > > > > > > example
>> > > > > > > > > > of Conway's Law btw. [1]
>> > > > > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > > > > > Anyhow. Deep breath! Software has
bugs, people will
>> > report
>> > > > > them,
>> > > > > > > and
>> > > > > > > > > > we'll continue to improve. This is a
very large group
>> with
>> > a
>> > > > very
>> > > > > > > > diverse
>> > > > > > > > > > community that spans regular old hackers
to the humble
>> web
>> > > > > > designers.
>> > > > > > > > We
>> > > > > > > > > > need to respect that, and maybe be a
little more
>> > > compassionate
>> > > > to
>> > > > > > > each
>> > > > > > > > > > other too. All software is fucked up,
and at the end of
>> the
>> > > > day,
>> > > > > it
>> > > > > > > is
>> > > > > > > > > our
>> > > > > > > > > > perpetual job to make it a little less
fucked up.
>> > > > > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > > > > > [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conway's_law
>> > > > > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > > > > > [Inline image 1]
>> > > > > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Oct 17, 2013 at 1:16 PM,
Tommy Williams <
>> > > > > > > tommy@devgeeks.org
>> > > > > > > > > > <mailto:tommy@devgeeks.org>>
wrote:
>> > > > > > > > > > > Late to the party due to timezone
fun, but I just
>> want to
>> > > > chime
>> > > > > > in
>> > > > > > > in
>> > > > > > > > > > > support of the CLI.
>> > > > > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > > > > > As a dev working on an actual nontrivial
"real world"
>> > app,
>> > > I
>> > > > > > would
>> > > > > > > > like
>> > > > > > > > > > to
>> > > > > > > > > > > let it be known that we (SpiderOak)
have been heavy
>> > > drinkers
>> > > > of
>> > > > > > the
>> > > > > > > > CLI
>> > > > > > > > > > > Kool-Aid since its infancy.
>> > > > > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > > > > > We have even managed to get to
the point where
>> > > > ./platforms/**/*
>> > > > > > is
>> > > > > > > > > just a
>> > > > > > > > > > > build artefact (mostly by using
hooks and tying the
>> whole
>> > > > thing
>> > > > > > > > > together
>> > > > > > > > > > > with Grunt).
>> > > > > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > > > > > We have a fast and fairly complex
app (both many core
>> > > plugins
>> > > > > as
>> > > > > > > well
>> > > > > > > > > > and a
>> > > > > > > > > > > few custom/third party ones), that
even includes the
>> > > ability
>> > > > to
>> > > > > > > white
>> > > > > > > > > > label
>> > > > > > > > > > > it with relative ease.
>> > > > > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > > > > > I feel pretty strongly in favour
of the CLI and
>> strongly
>> > > > > advocate
>> > > > > > > its
>> > > > > > > > > use
>> > > > > > > > > > > when asked in the #phonegap IRC
channel.
>> > > > > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > > > > > Just my opinion, but thought it
was important to add
>> to
>> > the
>> > > > > > > > discussion.
>> > > > > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > > > > > - tommy / devgeeks
>> > > > > > > > > > > On 18 Oct 2013 04:44, "Anis KADRI"
<
>> anis.kadri@gmail.com
>> > > > > <mailto:
>> > > > > > > > > > anis.kadri@gmail.com>> wrote:
>> > > > > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > > > > >> Sweet. So I think we all agree
(expect Joe perhaps?)
>> > that
>> > > > both
>> > > > > > > > > > >> approaches should be supported
:-)
>> > > > > > > > > > >>
>> > > > > > > > > > >> On Thu, Oct 17, 2013 at 10:31
AM, Carlos Santana <
>> > > > > > > > > csantana23@gmail.com
>> > > > > > > > > > <mailto:csantana23@gmail.com>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >> wrote:
>> > > > > > > > > > >>> I meant in addition of
".cordova/lib" also allow
>> also
>> > to
>> > > do
>> > > > > > > > something
>> > > > > > > > > > >> like
>> > > > > > > > > > >>> "cordova platform add ios
>> > > > > > > --path="./cordova_components/cordova-ios"
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>> On Thu, Oct 17, 2013 at
1:28 PM, Carlos Santana <
>> > > > > > > > > csantana23@gmail.com
>> > > > > > > > > > <mailto:csantana23@gmail.com>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>> wrote:
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>> ++1  "to install from
a given directory instead of
>> > > > > > > .cordova/libs."
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>> On Thu, Oct 17, 2013
at 12:10 PM, Viras <
>> > > > > > > > > viras@users.sourceforge.net
>> > > > > > > > > > <mailto:viras@users.sourceforge.net>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>> wrote:
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>> This might be true
- it took me quite some time to
>> > > figure
>> > > > > out
>> > > > > > > how
>> > > > > > > > > the
>> > > > > > > > > > >> CLI
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>> actually works
- despite also having to fix one or
>> > two
>> > > > bugs
>> > > > > > for
>> > > > > > > > the
>> > > > > > > > > > WPX
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>> implementation
of the CLI code (as well as the
>> > Windows
>> > > 8
>> > > > > CLI
>> > > > > > > > code).
>> > > > > > > > > > But
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>> still I would hate
to see the CLI go, since I
>> think
>> > > once
>> > > > > you
>> > > > > > > are
>> > > > > > > > > used
>> > > > > > > > > > >> to
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>> it, it saves you
quite a lot of time (I still have
>> > > those
>> > > > > old
>> > > > > > > > > > documents
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>> which guide me
through the setup of the IDE
>> projects
>> > > for
>> > > > > the
>> > > > > > > > > > different
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>> platforms - which
is now mostly obsolete).
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>> So I guess supporting
both methods is the way to
>> > go...
>> > > :)
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>> Best,
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>> Wolfgang
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>> Am 2013-10-17 16:13,
schrieb Michal Mocny:
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>> Thanks so much
for chiming in, I'm very happy to
>> see
>> > > that
>> > > > > > > you've
>> > > > > > > > > > >> figured
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> out how to
leverage the benefits and avoid the
>> > > drawbacks
>> > > > > of
>> > > > > > > the
>> > > > > > > > > new
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> workflow, and
that it has led to increased
>> > > productivity
>> > > > > for
>> > > > > > > you.
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> I do think
that perhaps it is still too difficult
>> > for
>> > > > > every
>> > > > > > > > > > developer
>> > > > > > > > > > >> to
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> learn what
you already have.
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> -Michal
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> On Thu, Oct
17, 2013 at 12:13 AM, Viras <
>> > > > > > > > > > viras@users.sourceforge.net<mailto:
>> > > viras@users.sourceforge.net
>> > > > >>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> wrote:
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>> my view on
this discussion:
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> I've used
the CLI to release the latest version
>> of
>> > > GOFG
>> > > > > > > Sports
>> > > > > > > > > > >> Computer
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> for Windows
Phone. The support for the "merges"
>> > > > directory
>> > > > > > is
>> > > > > > > a
>> > > > > > > > > > >> fantastic
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> feature
which allows me to focus on the
>> javascript
>> > > code
>> > > > > > using
>> > > > > > > > > e.g.
>> > > > > > > > > > >> the
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> NetBeans
IDE - I can finally handle all my
>> platform
>> > > > > > specific
>> > > > > > > > code
>> > > > > > > > > > >> from
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> JavaScript
in one consistent directory
>> structure -
>> > > > which
>> > > > > is
>> > > > > > > > what
>> > > > > > > > > > >> Cordova
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> should
be about.
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> In addition
the CLI forces you to write clean
>> code
>> > > (not
>> > > > > > > > implying
>> > > > > > > > > > that
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> the
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> other method
forces to write messy code). If you
>> > need
>> > > > > > > something
>> > > > > > > > > > >> native
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> write a
clean plugin for it (which also makes
>> the
>> > > code
>> > > > > > > > reusable)
>> > > > > > > > > -
>> > > > > > > > > > no
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> need
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> to mess
around in the native projects code -
>> this
>> > > also
>> > > > > > makes
>> > > > > > > > > > >> upgrading
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> cordova
much easier.
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> Once I've
done the Windows Phone version I've
>> > simply
>> > > > > added
>> > > > > > > > > Android
>> > > > > > > > > > >> as a
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> platform,
build it and I was done - no need for
>> > > > fiddling
>> > > > > > > around
>> > > > > > > > > > with
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> SDK /
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> IDE setup
etc (besides actually installing it).
>> So
>> > > CLI
>> > > > is
>> > > > > > my
>> > > > > > > > > > favorite
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> way
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> to develop
now - and it is far more powerful
>> than
>> > the
>> > > > old
>> > > > > > > > > approach
>> > > > > > > > > > >> (in
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> my
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> opinion)
- since it saves you from fiddling
>> around
>> > > with
>> > > > > > > project
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> settings,
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> etc. when
you do a multi-platform release.
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> Oh yes
- and GOFG SC uses two custom plugins, 5
>> > > > official
>> > > > > > > > plugins
>> > > > > > > > > > and
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> cordova
3.0 - so it is a bit beyond the "Hello
>> > World"
>> > > > > > > > > > application....
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> And I do
not agree that it isn't possible to
>> work
>> > > with
>> > > > > the
>> > > > > > > > native
>> > > > > > > > > > >> IDEs
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> with their
own projects - this is simply wrong
>> > since
>> > > > you
>> > > > > > can
>> > > > > > > > > always
>> > > > > > > > > > >> go
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> to
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> the "platforms"
directory and open the
>> > > > platform-projects
>> > > > > > > using
>> > > > > > > > > > their
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> native
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> IDE from
there (I've done this myself for e.g.
>> > plugin
>> > > > > > > > > development).
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> Still I
agree that both versions should be
>> > supported
>> > > -
>> > > > > but
>> > > > > > > > don't
>> > > > > > > > > > make
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> the
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> assumption
that the CLI is for "n00bs" only!
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> Best,
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> Wolfgang
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> Am 2013-10-16
23:11, schrieb Joe Bowser:
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> On Wed,
Oct 16, 2013 at 1:37 PM, Michal Mocny <
>> > > > > > > > > mmocny@chromium.org
>> > > > > > > > > > <mailto:mmocny@chromium.org>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> wrote:
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> Anis:
Totally agrees, but its important to
>> > highlight
>> > > > > that
>> > > > > > > both
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
directions
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
for that arguments hold.  We've done our best
>> to
>> > > > > support
>> > > > > > > bin/
>> > > > > > > > > > >> scripts
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
post
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
3.0, yet blanket statements like "CLI should
>> not
>> > be
>> > > > > used
>> > > > > > > with
>> > > > > > > > > > >> IDE", or
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
"CLI
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
sucks unless you just doing something trivial"
>> > are
>> > > > > being
>> > > > > > > > thrown
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
around,
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
which are harmful in my opinion, and I don't
>> > think
>> > > > its
>> > > > > > fair
>> > > > > > > > > that
>> > > > > > > > > > >> some
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
of
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
us
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
are promoting that message to users.
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
I don't think we're communicating with our
>> users
>> > at
>> > > > > all,
>> > > > > > > so I
>> > > > > > > > > > >> don't
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> see
how this could be communicated.  When users
>> > > > > > communicate
>> > > > > > > > > their
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> frustrations,
it's usually something like this
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> (
>> > > > > > http://www.infil00p.org/****config-xml-changes-for-ios-**<
>> > > > > > > > > > >>
>> http://www.infil00p.org/**config-xml-changes-for-ios-**
>> > >
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> and-android/#comment-10731<htt**p://
>> > > > > > > > www.infil00p.org/config-**<
>> > > > > > > > > > http://www.infil00p.org/config-**>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>
>> xml-changes-for-ios-and-**android/#comment-10731<
>> > > > > > > > > > >>
>> > > > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > >
>> > > > > >
>> > > > >
>> > > >
>> > >
>> >
>> http://www.infil00p.org/config-xml-changes-for-ios-and-android/#comment-10731
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> )
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> and
this
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> (
>> > > > > > > >
>> http://www.infil00p.org/****introducing-cordova-3-0-0-for-****
>> > > > > > > > > <
>> > > > > > > > > > >>
>> > > http://www.infil00p.org/**introducing-cordova-3-0-0-for-**>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> android/#comment-10694<http://**
>> > > > > > > > www.infil00p.org/introducing-**
>> > > > > > > > > <
>> > > > > > > > > > http://www.infil00p.org/introducing-**>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> cordova-3-0-0-for-android/#**comment-10694<
>> > > > > > > > > > >>
>> > > > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > >
>> > > > > >
>> > > > >
>> > > >
>> > >
>> >
>> http://www.infil00p.org/introducing-cordova-3-0-0-for-android/#comment-10694
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> ).
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> CLI
works well for me, and while its not
>> perfect,
>> > I
>> > > > > strive
>> > > > > > > to
>> > > > > > > > > > learn
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> its
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
limitations and make it better, not condemn
>> it.
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> I avoid
it because it's not developed for me,
>> or
>> > > > > > developers
>> > > > > > > > like
>> > > > > > > > > > me
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> who
like to see a big pile of output when
>> things
>> > > fail.
>> > > > >  I
>> > > > > > > > > avoided
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> having
any part in its development because I
>> > thought
>> > > > it
>> > > > > > was
>> > > > > > > > the
>> > > > > > > > > > >> wrong
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> way
to do things.  I assumed that the majority
>> of
>> > > > users
>> > > > > > > > actually
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> wanted
this and that I should do my best to
>> work
>> > > > around
>> > > > > > > this,
>> > > > > > > > > but
>> > > > > > > > > > >> with
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> the
backlash that we're getting, such as the
>> blog
>> > > > posts
>> > > > > > and
>> > > > > > > > some
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> comments
on the Google Groups, it seems that
>> this
>> > > is a
>> > > > > > > feature
>> > > > > > > > > > very
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> few
people actually wanted.
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> As
far as the CordovaWebView use case, I
>> actually
>> > > have
>> > > > > > never
>> > > > > > > > > tried
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> that.
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
Has anyone bothered to make sure it works well
>> > > > > post-3.0,
>> > > > > > or
>> > > > > > > > > does
>> > > > > > > > > > >> Joe
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
have
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
a point that we missed addressing this?
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> We
have JUnit unit tests in the Android
>> repository
>> > > to
>> > > > > make
>> > > > > > > > sure
>> > > > > > > > > > that
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> this
still works.  However, I would like to see
>> > this
>> > > > > test
>> > > > > > > case
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> revisited
since it may be more appropriate to
>> have
>> > > > > > > > > CordovaActivity
>> > > > > > > > > > >> be
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> inherited
instead of CordovaInterface, or for
>> both
>> > > to
>> > > > be
>> > > > > > > > > > supported.
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> This
is so that we can make more hybrid
>> > applications
>> > > > and
>> > > > > > > deal
>> > > > > > > > > with
>> > > > > > > > > > >> the
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> fact
that we're so brutally non-complaint with
>> > > Android
>> > > > > UI
>> > > > > > > > > > guidelines
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> instead
of just ignoring it.  I'll probably
>> bring
>> > > this
>> > > > > up
>> > > > > > > and
>> > > > > > > > > > >> present
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> more
source code when it's ready to explain
>> why we
>> > > > need
>> > > > > > this
>> > > > > > > > > > feature
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> in
the next couple of weeks, and why it's
>> > important
>> > > to
>> > > > > > > respect
>> > > > > > > > > the
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>> platform,
even when the platform doesn't
>> respect
>> > the
>> > > > > web.
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> --
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> GOFG -
Get On Fat Guy
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>> http://www.gofg.at/
- powered by Cordova
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>> --
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>> GOFG - Get On Fat
Guy
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>> http://www.gofg.at/
- powered by Cordova
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>> --
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>> Carlos Santana
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>> <csantana23@gmail.com<mailto:csantana23@gmail.com
>> >>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>> --
>> > > > > > > > > > >>> Carlos Santana
>> > > > > > > > > > >>> <csantana23@gmail.com<mailto:csantana23@gmail.com>>
>> > > > > > > > > > >>
>> > > > > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > > >
>> > > > > > >
>> > > > > >
>> > > > >
>> > > >
>> > >
>> >
>>
>
>

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