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From Braden Shepherdson <bra...@chromium.org>
Subject Re: Moving www into an app folder
Date Mon, 25 Mar 2013 18:25:02 GMT
They are, right now, a kind of middle ground. If you rm -rf'd the
directory, it wouldn't be all better on the next cordova prepare; that's
where we hope to reach soon.

On the other hand, you definitely shouldn't be having code in them - native
or otherwise - that didn't come from a plugin or from www/. So they could
be reconstructed from data stored elsewhere, which makes them mostly a
build artifact, and certainly not necessary to store in your source control.

Braden


On Mon, Mar 25, 2013 at 2:17 PM, Brian LeRoux <b@brian.io> wrote:

> While this might be our goal it is in no way true that ./platforms ia
> build artifact today or anytime soon.
>
> On Mon, Mar 25, 2013 at 10:55 AM, Braden Shepherdson
> <braden@chromium.org> wrote:
> > The same is /not/ true of the current structure, because one (probably)
> > doesn't want to be committing build artifacts like platforms/, or cached
> > third-party data like plugins/ into your git repo.
> >
> > The idea here is that everything under app/ is what you would keep in git
> > for a team working on an app: www, config.xml, docs, samples, etc.
> Putting
> > that content at the top-level instead means you have lots of extra build
> > artifact cruft in your git repo, or your devs just have to know that
> > platforms/ and plugins/ are in .gitignore.
> >
> > Braden
> >
> >
> > On Mon, Mar 25, 2013 at 1:45 PM, Brian LeRoux <b@brian.io> wrote:
> >
> >> But, if you go up one level, the same is true w/ the current
> >> structure. Its just an organizational difference? (Thats a perfectly
> >> ok answer of course. Aesthetics and symmetry are plenty convincing
> >> arguments.)
> >>
> >> In my view ./merges isn't your app. The ./merges dir is in parts of
> >> your app on a per platform basis. Hence the logic for having it exist
> >> at the same level as ./platforms.
> >>
> >> Having config.xml exist in the ../www does bother me.
> >>
> >>
> >> On Mon, Mar 25, 2013 at 10:33 AM, Braden Shepherdson
> >> <braden@chromium.org> wrote:
> >> > It allows easier cloning of your app (meaning the www, config.xml, and
> >> any
> >> > samples and so on) into a self-contained directory. It also lets us
> keep
> >> > the user's app within a single top-level directory (rather than www
> and
> >> > merges and potentially more later).
> >> >
> >> > Because only the www (and merges) would get pulled into the actual
> app,
> >> any
> >> > docs, samples, tests, or other miscellany in the git repo won't be
> part
> >> of
> >> > the app.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > On Mon, Mar 25, 2013 at 1:19 PM, Brian LeRoux <b@brian.io> wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> Ok, let me try again. What is precisely problem we are solving by
> >> >> changing the structure? To be clear, I'm not really against or for
> it.
> >> >> I just don't understand why this is important.
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> On Mon, Mar 25, 2013 at 10:06 AM, Braden Shepherdson
> >> >> <braden@chromium.org> wrote:
> >> >> > +1 is still a handy means of displaying your support or otherwise.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > If you do want to version the platforms/ and plugins/ folders
at
> the
> >> top
> >> >> > level, you can do that. If you're versioning everything, then
you
> >> should
> >> >> be
> >> >> > checking out that master repo, rather than the master repo and
then
> >> the
> >> >> app
> >> >> > repo inside it, so it should all work fine.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Braden
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> > On Mon, Mar 25, 2013 at 12:37 PM, Brian LeRoux <b@brian.io>
wrote:
> >> >> >
> >> >> >> (Btw this isn't a vote thread guys.)
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> On Mon, Mar 25, 2013 at 9:37 AM, Brian LeRoux <b@brian.io>
wrote:
> >> >> >> > So, what if you want to version the ./platorms folder?
I don't
> like
> >> >> >> > it, but ppl will do.
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> > On Mon, Mar 25, 2013 at 9:10 AM, James Jong <
> wjamesjong@gmail.com>
> >> >> >> wrote:
> >> >> >> >> +1 for app folder and cordova create <app location>
> >> >> >> >> I would like to see it support a git-URL or local.
 It's nice
> to
> >> have
> >> >> >> it all neatly in app/  but can also see arguments for having
www/
> as
> >> >> >> top-level.
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >> -James Jong
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >> On Mar 25, 2013, at 10:32 AM, Braden Shepherdson
<
> >> >> braden@chromium.org>
> >> >> >> wrote:
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >>> A big +1 from me for this world, Michal's option
2.
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>> I want to be able to cordova create <some-git-URL>,
and have
> it
> >> >> create
> >> >> >> an
> >> >> >> >>> empty project where the app/ directory is the
git repo.
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>> Then a full project might look like this:
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>> platforms/
> >> >> >> >>>    android/
> >> >> >> >>>    ios/
> >> >> >> >>> plugins/
> >> >> >> >>>    ...
> >> >> >> >>> app/
> >> >> >> >>>    merges/
> >> >> >> >>>        ...
> >> >> >> >>>    www/
> >> >> >> >>>        ...
> >> >> >> >>>    README.md
> >> >> >> >>>    config.xml
> >> >> >> >>>    docs/
> >> >> >> >>>    etc...
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>> So I can have whatever meta-information I want
inside my app/
> >> (and
> >> >> >> >>> therefore my git repo) - tests, docs, samples,
etc. - but not
> >> inside
> >> >> >> the
> >> >> >> >>> www that actually ships. This makes it sane to
have just the
> >> app's
> >> >> >> files in
> >> >> >> >>> git, but not the platforms/ or plugins/ directories.
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>> Braden
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>> On Sun, Mar 24, 2013 at 6:02 PM, Michal Mocny
<
> >> mmocny@chromium.org>
> >> >> >> wrote:
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>>> So a few questions:
> >> >> >> >>>>
> >> >> >> >>>> 0. Do we want to support app distribution?
 Sample apps, Test
> >> >> Harness,
> >> >> >> >>>> working in a team, open source projects..
hint at yes, but we
> >> could
> >> >> >> just
> >> >> >> >>>> leave that to be done manually.
> >> >> >> >>>> 1. Do we want to support app documentation?
Where would you
> put
> >> it
> >> >> if
> >> >> >> you
> >> >> >> >>>> wanted to ship it along with a app?
> >> >> >> >>>> 2. Do we have any apps already using the
merges/ folder?
>  How do
> >> >> they
> >> >> >> ship
> >> >> >> >>>> it?
> >> >> >> >>>>
> >> >> >> >>>> I suspect what would happen now is app devs
would already
> need
> >> an
> >> >> app
> >> >> >> >>>> folder to keep all the pieces, would cordova
create a
> workspace,
> >> >> and
> >> >> >> >>>> link/copy over www/ and merges/.
> >> >> >> >>>>
> >> >> >> >>>> If we wanted to support app distribution
(such that say
> cordova
> >> >> create
> >> >> >> >>>> <path-to-app>), we would need to support
importing from an
> app
> >> >> folder
> >> >> >> (for
> >> >> >> >>>> the two folder merges and www reason alone).
 Yet we
> currently
> >> >> plan to
> >> >> >> >>>> unpack that app folder inside the workspace.
> >> >> >> >>>>
> >> >> >> >>>> -Michal
> >> >> >> >>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>
> >> >> >> >>>> On Sun, Mar 24, 2013 at 5:22 PM, Brian LeRoux
<b@brian.io>
> >> wrote:
> >> >> >> >>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>> Ya no worries we'll advocate on best
for the project vs our
> >> >> >> particular
> >> >> >> >>>>> downstream. File path handling, while
tedious, is most
> >> certainly
> >> >> not
> >> >> >> a
> >> >> >> >>>>> reason to block a reasonable change.
> >> >> >> >>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>> I think this is reasonable but not convinced
it is a win.
> >> >> >> >>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>> On Fri, Mar 22, 2013 at 7:35 PM, Michal
Mocny <
> >> >> mmocny@chromium.org>
> >> >> >> >>>> wrote:
> >> >> >> >>>>>> Ah yes, I see what you are asking.
 The point being that
> >> phonegap
> >> >> >> build
> >> >> >> >>>>>> would need to change to work with
the new structure.
> >> >> >> >>>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>>> Its a fair point, and its important
generally to not harm
> >> >> downstream
> >> >> >> >>>>>> distributions on purpose, but I think
we generally should
> do
> >> >> whats
> >> >> >> best
> >> >> >> >>>>> for
> >> >> >> >>>>>> cordova and give downstream every
opportunity to adjust.
>  With
> >> >> this
> >> >> >> >>>>>> particular proposal I can only image
it would not be a
> >> problem,
> >> >> >> >>>>> especially
> >> >> >> >>>>>> if they use the same tools internally
(but the actual
> phonegap
> >> >> build
> >> >> >> >>>> team
> >> >> >> >>>>>> should speak here).
> >> >> >> >>>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>>> -Michal
> >> >> >> >>>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>>> On Fri, Mar 22, 2013 at 10:27 PM,
Tommy-Carlos Williams
> >> >> >> >>>>>> <tommy@devgeeks.org>wrote:
> >> >> >> >>>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>>>> I just mean that build expects
config.xml to be in www,
> yeah?
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>>>> On 23/03/2013, at 1:12 PM, Michal
Mocny <
> mmocny@chromium.org
> >> >
> >> >> >> wrote:
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>> But isn't the app incomplete
without the merges folder?
> >>  Most
> >> >> apps
> >> >> >> >>>>>>> probably
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>> don't use it, but for those
that do, a zip of www isn't
> >> enough,
> >> >> >> you
> >> >> >> >>>>>>> already
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>> need to ship more than just
the www folder.  Creating an
> app
> >> >> >> folder
> >> >> >> >>>>> would
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>> actually make the situation
easier I think.
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>> project
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>> - platforms
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>> - ..
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>> - plugins
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>> - ...
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>> - app(s?)
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>> - www/
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>> - merges/
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>> - config.xml
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>> - README.md
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>> - docs/
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>> - etc stuff that doesn't
get copied into platform/
> output on
> >> >> build
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>> (oh, and hey, notice the
similarity in structure to
> plugins?
> >> >> just
> >> >> >> >>>>>>> sayin..)
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>> On Fri, Mar 22, 2013 at 7:00
PM, Tommy-Carlos Williams
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>> <tommy@devgeeks.org>wrote:
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>> Can I just ask a question
about this?
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>> Is the config.xml supposed
to be compatible with
> >> >> >> >>>> build.phonegap.comat
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>> all?
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>> I ask because I could
see a scenario where you might
> want
> >> to
> >> >> use
> >> >> >> >>>> the
> >> >> >> >>>>> cli
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>> tools, but still utilise
build.phonegap.com for other
> >> >> platforms
> >> >> >> >>>> (or
> >> >> >> >>>>>>> even
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>> for the ones supported
by the cli).
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>> If the cli config.xml
is "build" compatible, it makes
> sense
> >> >> for
> >> >> >> it
> >> >> >> >>>>> to be
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>> in the www folder so
that the www folder can go
> straight to
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>> build.phonegap.com.
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>> On 23/03/2013, at 9:15
AM, Brian LeRoux <b@brian.io>
> >> wrote:
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>> I'm ok with ./merges
at the same level as ./www but the
> >> >> >> config.xml
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>> inside of ./www bugs
me too. I think having a root
> level
> >> >> ./www
> >> >> >> >>>> just
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>> works well mentally
in that its obvious whats there,
> what
> >> it
> >> >> >> does,
> >> >> >> >>>>> and
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>> who it effects. The
./merges folder is really just
> stuff
> >> that
> >> >> >> gets
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>> added to ./www in
the right cases so having at the same
> >> >> depth is
> >> >> >> >>>> ok
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>> (for me).
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>> I get where you are
coming from though.
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>> The real sticky bit
is a config file hiding with the
> app
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>> implementation. It
seems like that would live at the
> root.
> >> >> The
> >> >> >> >>>> idea
> >> >> >> >>>>> of
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>> having it inside
of ./www is a simple zip and rename of
> >> ./www
> >> >> >> >>>> would
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>> result in an installable
package...but logically with
> our
> >> >> >> tooling
> >> >> >> >>>>> and
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>> such that would be
a build artifact that just lives in
> >> >> >> ./platforms
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>> after we do our magic.
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>> =/
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>> On Fri, Mar 22, 2013
at 1:24 PM, Michal Mocny <
> >> >> >> >>>> mmocny@chromium.org>
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>> wrote:
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>> Paraphrasing
our meeting notes today:
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>> * currently www/
has to have config.xml inside it,
> docs
> >> >> inside
> >> >> >> >>>> it,
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>> README
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>> etc
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>> * merges folder
is already a sibling of www/ but its
> >> >> logically
> >> >> >> >>>>> part of
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>> the
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>> app.
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>> * So, why not
move everything that isn't the actual
> >> assets
> >> >> of
> >> >> >> the
> >> >> >> >>>>> app
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>> itself out of
www?
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>> * Option 1: move
everything out into the root.
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>> * harder for
git versioning your app, since cordova
> >> >> artifacts
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>> (platforms, plugins)
are inside.
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>> * Option 2: make
a new top level "app/" folder that
> holds
> >> >> >> merges/
> >> >> >> >>>>> and
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>> www/
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>> and manifestes
etc
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>> * then you can
just clone/install an app into one
> >> location
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>> And I'll throw
out a third option: Create an "apps"
> >> folder
> >> >> >> which
> >> >> >> >>>>> can
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>> have
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>> any number of
named apps, like plugins.
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>> I think (2) should
be totally doable (just change some
> >> >> default
> >> >> >> >>>>> paths
> >> >> >> >>>>>>> in
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>> the
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>> tooling) and
is a strict improvement (minus the
> hassle of
> >> >> >> moving
> >> >> >> >>>>> your
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>> files
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>> around the first
time for app devs).  (3) I think is
> >> >> >> interesting,
> >> >> >> >>>>> but
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>> is a
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>> bit of a departure.
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>>> -Michal
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >>
> >> >>
> >>
>

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