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From Ross Gardler <>
Subject Re: [proposal] Moving to Git
Date Sun, 27 Nov 2011 10:46:26 GMT
Sent from my mobile device, please forgive errors and brevity.
On Nov 27, 2011 10:38 AM, "Jukka Zitting" <> wrote:
> Hi,
> +1 Great idea, thanks for pushing this!
> At first, when it became clear how disruptive the switch to svn would be,
> considered it best overall to postpone the migration to Apache infra, but
> it's obviously better if there's a chance for us to actively help move
> things forward. And as you say the experience of the Callback team would
> likely help also the ASF in general.

I suspect that had you approached infra during the proposal of this
incubation project things would have been different. The CouchDB trial had
only just started. Today, from a technical pointy of view, infra seem
reasonably happy everything is OK. They expect to have the final issues
resolved in January.

> I'm also able and willing to help with any required backend stuff.

Excellent, that adds much more weight to the proposal. Thanks.


> BR,
> Jukka Zitting
> On Nov 26, 2011 11:13 PM, "Ross Gardler" <>
> >
> > As some here may know, the ASF has been preparing to roll Git out to all
> > projects that want it. This work had been non-trivial, the
> > team have been working on the technical issues since committing to it at
> > ApacheCon in 2010 (and before that they had to figure out what the real
> > issues were).
> >
> > This work has led to the trial in CouchDB. This trial is designed to a)
> > test the technical solutions in a working project and b) educate people
> > like me who have no experience of working with Git in a community
> >
> > Since becoming aware of this projects desire to "wait it out" before
> moving
> > to the ASF I have been seeing if there is any way of making this happen
> > sooner rather than later.
> >
> > For example, on the infrastructure list I said:
> >
> > "They (PhoneGap/Callback) have an existing GitHub based community and
> a
> > well respected project in their own right. The nature of their project
> > means that SVN is sub-optimal for reasons we don't hear in the typical
> Git Vs
> > SVN arguments (in short they have lots of platform specific forks of
> > core code but seek to ensure a strong community around the core and each
> of
> > those forks).
> > From my limited engagement with them so far I find them respectful of
> > ASFs position and willing to work with us on addressing our concerns.
> > not yet sure of how "Apache like" their existing community is, but I do
> > find myself saying one thing as a mentor ("you are not allowed to do
> this")
> > whilst feeling another ("you should be allowed to help educate us
> I
> > think we are missing an opportunity.
> >
> > With strong mentorship I believe this particular project could help us
> > accelerate
> > the evaluation of Git within ASF communities. I am a mentor and I'm
> willing
> > to commit to safeguarding the experiment."
> >
> > As you can see, I have some significant concerns. Git, as a tool, can be
> > useful to a community managed project. However, it was designed for an
> > entirely different management model (the Benevolent Dictator). I'm not
> > currently sure of where on this spectrum PhoneGap/Callbac sits. However,
> > you asked to come to the ASF, your champion is well respected by more
> > just myself and you have some great mentors (not including me of
> I
> > assume we are on fairly safe ground here.
> >
> > The response to my enquiries has been very positive (it's amazing how
> > ill-informed bloggers can be). As a result (and because another mentor
> > stepped up to support my position) I'm willing to make a case to
> > infrastructure for you to move to Git ASAP, but I have two conditions
> > before I make that request.
> >
> > The first is that all mentors on this project support my proposal.
> >
> > The second condition is that the team ensure that the documentation over
> on
> > the CouchDB project reflects the process that this project will follow
> > managing the canonical repository here at the ASF. I want it to describe
> > how you will manage committer contributions, non-committer
> > IP review, releases and whatever else is important to your project.
> >
> > I'm not really interested in the nitty gritty of the processes, we'll
> > that out in practice. What I want is a document that convinces me that
> > there will be a single canonical repository for the community to engage
> > with. If I am confident you can use Git in an Apache Way style process
> then
> > I'm willing to make the case to infrastructure, and if necessary, the
> > board. I'm reasonably sure that if you can convince me and the other
> > mentors here then we can convince the infrastructure team.
> >
> > Since you are in the incubator and I know nothing of your current
> > governance and I don't know if it is close or distant from the Apache
> > On the CouchDB list I have posted some comments from an ASF project
> > which defines the process they use in a git-svn environment (they came
> from
> > Git when they came to the ASF). This mail will, hopefully,  be a useful
> > starting point (or maybe its all covered in the wiki page already). See
> >
> >
> > Taking off my mentor hat for a moment and putting on my VP Community
> > Development hat I will use this document, and what I learn from this
> > incubation project, to help ensure that Git can be used successfully
> > alongside SVN in Apache projects.
> >
> > However, please understand that even after all this I cannot guarantee
> that
> > infrastructure will agree to allow you to move to Git. However, I am
> > confident enough to be willing to spend some of my time on it, hopefully
> > you will be too.
> >
> > Are mentors OK with this?
> >
> > Are committers OK with this as a way forwards? Do the committers have
> > questions or observations?
> >
> > Ross
 On Nov 27, 2011 10:38 AM, "Jukka Zitting" <> wrote:

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