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From: Ross Gardler <Ross.Gardler@microsoft.com>
To: "dev@community.apache.org" <dev@community.apache.org>,
	"dev@community.apache.org" <dev@community.apache.org>
Subject: Re: On wearing multiple hats
Thread-Topic: On wearing multiple hats
Thread-Index: AQHSLpR2ie8S4+vktEWkIDCFAIqFhqC5OFT5
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 2016 14:19:06 +0000
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First, I'm tired of hearing it too but let's not be fooled, most of the tim=
e it comes from people ill informed about how the ASF works.

We use social controls within the projects and we have a fully independent =
board to handle escalations should a community member feel that their (or a=
nothers) merit not be recognized.

If this is breaking down then its a problem within the PMC not with the pro=
cess, which has served us well for many years across many projects and shou=
ld, IMHO, serve us well for many more. Rather than starting to look for a s=
olution to a problem purebred by others perhaps we should look at why they =
have this perception.

Here's my thoughts...

Open source, in general, has changed. Its gone from mostly individual hacke=
rs from small collaborating companies "scratching their own itch" to mostly=
 big business and will funded startups paying individuals who sometimes don=
't care on a personal level. This has resulted in the emergence of a differ=
ent flavor of open source. One in which money and metrics count more than c=
ommunity and code. I'm the money and metrics model success means market dis=
ruption rather than collaboration on code.

I maintain that the Apache Way is still a highly valuable and repeatable pr=
ocess that when applied correctly brings the highest chance of success (whe=
re success is valuable open source code). It is a process that is designed =
to ensure that those who care on a personal level have as much influence as=
 those who are motivated by external need. It is a process that leaves mone=
y and metrics at the door but recognizes community and code contributions q=
uickly.

I'm not a fan of metrics. They are often misleading and allow any story to =
be told. I'm much more interested in people taking responsibility for the h=
ealth of their community than taking the easy route and monitoring an arbit=
rary metric. Those people should be working within project PMCs to ensure a=
ll contributions (code or otherwise) are being recognized. They should be i=
dentifying new committees not a "number of commits" metric that ignores the=
 individual who facilitates consensus and merit recognition on our mailing =
lists.

If a PMC is devoid of such individuals then it is nothing more than a share=
d code base regardless of how many new committers are brought in. Those pro=
jects exist, but they should not exist in the ASF where we stand for "commu=
nity before code".

The current metric, reported quarterly, to a vendor neutral and member elec=
ted board is "last addition of a committer". This is good. When it goes a l=
ong time the board should ask "why". Sometimes its because a project is in =
maintenance mode (no problem with that) other times its because a PMC is no=
t recognizing contributions and needs reminding.

Do we really need metrics? Perhaps we need more awareness in our communitie=
s about why building a personal profile in a project is good for both caree=
r and community. Then we can help people build those personal profiles by e=
nsuring we recognizing all contributions that bring stability, independence=
 and health to a project community.

Ross


---
Twitter: @rgardler

________________________________
From: Isabel Drost-Fromm <isabel@apache.org>
Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2016 12:50:21 AM
To: dev@community.apache.org
Subject: On wearing multiple hats

Pre-text: This conversation started among several members of the ASF, you a=
re
seeing this message here, as it was suggested to have the discussion on a
public mailing list so everyone can participate.


Hi,

tl;dr: I'm tired of hearing Apache is "where large firms dump code (to brea=
k the
market for other or to avoid looking bad for abandoning it", I'm also tired=
 of
hearing that Apache is where projects are controlled by corporate interests
under the disguise of some Apache Way process. I would like to figure out
whether this is actually true based on numbers instead of subjective
perceptions. If it is true I would like to figure out if and how we need to=
 fix
this.


Longer version: Every now and then I hear people complain either privately =
or
publicly [1] that people working on Apache projects who are not paid to do =
that
work and have don't have the luxury to participate full-time are facing a h=
ard
time getting into our communities.

Similarly every now and then we see projects running into trademark issues,
conflicts of interest with their employers, trouble with wearing too many h=
ats
[2,3] (though everytime I hear about wearing more than one hat I have to th=
ink
of the following lightning talk [4]).

I don't think handwavery statements will get us very far. Maybe it makes se=
nse
to think about the following first:

- If projects are making progress (getting new releases out, getting new
  features implemented, getting bugs and security vulnerabilities addressed=
), do
  we care about how they are governed? Why do we care if we do? About which
  aspects do we care?

- Given the influx of projects into the incubator (and the number of projec=
ts
  making it through) people seem to trust the ASF as a home for their
  communities. What kind of value does that have for us? What is the value =
we
  are giving back to these projects?


Maybe from there we can come up with stories and metrics that hold (or shou=
ld
hold) for all of our projects.


Let me provide an example for illustration: In many previous conversations =
and
talks I stressed that Apache is about communities, that being part of an Ap=
ache
project doesn't necessarily mean that the particular human has to contribut=
e
large amounts of code - in the case of Mahout at some point we even had to
communicate that the best way to not be accepted as a GSoC student would be=
 to
propose to implement yet another machine learning algorithm as that would
probably not what the project needed most, nor would it be feasable given t=
he
time frame. Based on that my answer to "do we care about how projects are
governed" would be "yeah, sure we do - our system is based on merit, merit =
comes
from valuable contributions". The metric I'd setup to test that hypothesis =
is
true would be to cross-check number of contributions (patches, documentatio=
n
fixes and the like) with whether the people making these contributions are
actually being promoted to committer. Makes sense?

Anyone interested in this? Anyone interested in helping get sensible number=
s up
- my JIRA magic is seriously lacking...


Isabel


[1]
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ark-developers-list.1001551.n3.nabble.com%2FSpark-Improvement-Proposals-tt1=
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