Return-Path: X-Original-To: apmail-community-dev-archive@minotaur.apache.org Delivered-To: apmail-community-dev-archive@minotaur.apache.org Received: from mail.apache.org (hermes.apache.org [140.211.11.3]) by minotaur.apache.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 5888918457 for ; Mon, 10 Aug 2015 17:36:29 +0000 (UTC) Received: (qmail 78254 invoked by uid 500); 10 Aug 2015 17:36:29 -0000 Delivered-To: apmail-community-dev-archive@community.apache.org Received: (qmail 77952 invoked by uid 500); 10 Aug 2015 17:36:29 -0000 Mailing-List: contact dev-help@community.apache.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Post: List-Id: Reply-To: dev@community.apache.org Delivered-To: mailing list dev@community.apache.org Received: (qmail 77940 invoked by uid 99); 10 Aug 2015 17:36:28 -0000 Received: from Unknown (HELO spamd4-us-west.apache.org) (209.188.14.142) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Mon, 10 Aug 2015 17:36:28 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by spamd4-us-west.apache.org (ASF Mail Server at spamd4-us-west.apache.org) with ESMTP id 4FF67C0484 for ; Mon, 10 Aug 2015 17:36:28 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at spamd4-us-west.apache.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 3.46 X-Spam-Level: *** X-Spam-Status: No, score=3.46 tagged_above=-999 required=6.31 tests=[DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_ENVFROM_END_DIGIT=0.25, FROM_LOCAL_HEX=0.331, HTML_MESSAGE=3, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=disabled Authentication-Results: spamd4-us-west.apache.org (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mx1-us-west.apache.org ([10.40.0.8]) by localhost (spamd4-us-west.apache.org [10.40.0.11]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id chpZSlKowWKQ for ; Mon, 10 Aug 2015 17:36:27 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-wi0-f173.google.com (mail-wi0-f173.google.com [209.85.212.173]) by mx1-us-west.apache.org (ASF Mail Server at mx1-us-west.apache.org) with ESMTPS id 10BBF2104D for ; Mon, 10 Aug 2015 17:36:27 +0000 (UTC) Received: by wibhh20 with SMTP id hh20so160849542wib.0 for ; Mon, 10 Aug 2015 10:36:25 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; bh=WEoPhuQP+DynyO1+LOoa0xufLYNR+Zmpp+GPTNy2TpY=; b=m8YJ28iR1SWjtPB66/R+MurEDn5wC8hntKu5q827zMMxUDGszeqQLZ+8iM3NfvNvce +ceC47VNzeMI0tMADTTPbI3VItxYkUvWxesshdKXNq/gir8Uus51UD8NAPidpvBm1IJR iJl8SodOQuBNghAH8XAAlNbu6jxMqpRXUqzxU82kMZ/MDnLaJ2VoBdJXTa2FxmKyE7+z wJhVYb5dm/+kOvsV+/wTTvmfdYoxRhuVwFWNrrUiVpWSCAUU6IwwRcPqGJzg86s8VF+b DK4QvS4vM3yE1uBykpoqCY0p/hwBPOPSSDzp5nQE76PAgCiL+NA8LGN+j2T7oS93GAiQ m+1Q== MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.194.58.236 with SMTP id u12mr40377243wjq.36.1439228185628; Mon, 10 Aug 2015 10:36:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.27.6.197 with HTTP; Mon, 10 Aug 2015 10:36:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.27.6.197 with HTTP; Mon, 10 Aug 2015 10:36:25 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <0A45B62D-00FA-4F66-B357-E0240F9E65A1@gmail.com> <55C484B5.8000504@spielviel.de> <86B34B78-B3F6-4DE7-AD71-325272BA3C17@gmail.com> <00A12D1F-16AE-4798-B274-5D22B3E5D891@gmail.com> Date: Tue, 11 Aug 2015 01:36:25 +0800 Message-ID: Subject: Re: slack From: =?UTF-8?B?5p6X5pmJ5qif?= To: dev@community.apache.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=047d7ba97436c154bc051cf86c15 --047d7ba97436c154bc051cf86c15 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable 2015/8/11 =E4=B8=8A=E5=8D=881:35=E6=96=BC "Benson Margulies" =E5=AF=AB=E9=81=93=EF=BC=9A > > I think it's important to recognize how the board and the foundation > have handled this issue over time. > > The absolute requirement is open decision-making. Avoiding real-time > communications avoids many possible failures of open decision-making. > (Not, of course, all.) After all, the simplest primrose path here is > two people standing at the intersection of their cubicles. The policy > has always been to sternly warn that the use of real time mechanisms > involves risks of failure, and that failure involves risks of the > board's blunt instruments being deployed. Does all of this slow down > some processes, and cause some people of limited patience / boundless > energy to get frustrated? Yup, things have costs. > > Just writing up the results on the mailing list isn't good enough if > there is no real opportunity for people to question, deliberate, and > change the course of action. > > You want to have a bar camp, a con call, a slack discussion, a set of > messages exchanged by carrier pigeon? Then it's up to you to make sure > that you don't end up excluding people from the decision-making > process. --047d7ba97436c154bc051cf86c15--