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From Franco Perruna <>
Subject RE: Licensing Issue
Date Sat, 27 Jun 2015 20:07:23 GMT
 Am 27.06.2015 19:33 schrieb "Dennis E. Hamilton" <>:

> Sent off-list by mistake.  (fat-fingered the "To" list)
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Dennis E. Hamilton []
> Sent: Saturday, June 27, 2015 09:23
> To: 'Ted Dunning'
> Subject: RE: Licensing Issue
> The TL;DR My concern is about any statement that suggests claiming the
> whole work, not just the original aspect of the derivative, as under the
> copyright of the creator of the derivative.  Any attempt to enforce that
> can come to grief.  It is that one aspect of Ted’s statement about
> “claiming as one’s own” that I wanted to correct.  The making of the
> derivative of a CC0/public-domain work is not the problem, it is about any
> mistaken claim asserted over it.
>  - Dennis
> In the case of a CC0 or a public-domain work, the claiming of the
> derivative entire as under one’s own copyright will come to grief in
> litigation.  Not a likely case.  But it has happened in the past that
> usurpers have claimed such copyrights and used it as a threat against even
> the previous contributors.  The successful perpetrator believed that
> relicensing can happen this way, and the victims did not know otherwise.
> It is always good to be clear, especially in a combined work, what is
> subject to a particular claim.  The ASF policies on handling of third-party
> source codes is a good example.  Even though attribution is not necessarily
> a requirement, it demonstrates acting in good faith and I assume that
> matters a great deal to the Foundation.
> My favorite example of this has to do with how copyright is applied to
> republication of “The Wizard of Oz” book, long in the public domain.
> Print publishers do not always provide such clarity.  And one has no idea
> what private arrangements are made as part of the Rights & Permissions work
> that publishers (and film producers) go through.  I do note that many
> combined works provide an enumeration of original sources and sometimes
> “used with permission” notices, despite claiming copyright on the
> combination (also similar to what the LICENSE on an Apache Project release
> is tantamount to, since the ASF does not require copyright on contributions
> and that is quite deliberate.)
> The fundamental notion is a simple statement in the US Copyright code.  My
> own copyright subsists automatically and completely in the that portion of
> a work that (1) is copyrightable subject matter and (2) is my original
> contribution.  And to nothing else in that derivative.
> This will not absolve me of infringement of the original source for a
> derivative absent it being public domain or absent my having a license to
> make a derivative (i.e., the open-source case) in accordance with the
> conditions on the license.  I could also have become an owner of the
> copyright by explicit or automatic transfer.
> I.e., Sun and Oracle became owners of the source code by
> virtue of a CLA that included a non-exclusive transfer of copyright.  They
> did not need that from their own employees because of the work-for-hire
> provision and probably particulars of their employment agreements.  This is
> what made Apache OpenOffice possible, because it only required a simple SGA
> from Oracle alone.
>  -- Dennis, who does not even play a lawyer on cable.
> PS: I recently had two technical papers published.  I did not make any
> copyright transfer.  The boilerplate notice on each paper has these
> wordings:
>    “… Copyright for components of this worked owned by others
>     than [Publisher] must be honored. ...
>    "Copyright is held by the owner/author(s).  Publication
>     rights licensed to [Publisher]."
> The combined proceedings which incorporates those papers has a notice of
> copyright by [Publisher] in the front matter.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Ted Dunning []
> Sent: Saturday, June 27, 2015 01:19
> To:; Dennis Hamilton
> Subject: Re: Licensing Issue
> On Sat, Jun 27, 2015 at 12:53 AM, Dennis E. Hamilton <
>> wrote:
> There's a difference between making a claim, affixing a notice, etc., and
> it being lawful and the right to having done so being legally defensible.
> I suspect this normally doesn't matter and is a trifle unless a conflict
> of some sort drags the usurper into court.  Finding plagiarism, even in a
> derivative, will be quite unfortunate.
> I am confused here.
> How is making a derivative work of a CC0 licensed work going to ever come
> to grief?

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