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From Benedikt Ritter <>
Subject Re: Mailinglists - a tool from the 90s?
Date Mon, 19 Jan 2015 07:37:34 GMT

Guys, don't get me wrong, but you're sounding like a bunch of old man
talking about the good old days, where you did everything on the command
line. ;-)
I'm 29 and before Apache, I hadn't heard about mailing lists. It always
felt clumsy to me. I know github and twitter. That's just the stuff my
generation uses. I understand the requirements Phil brought up. But I don't
think that mailing lists are the golden way to fulfill those requirements.
And when people stop contributing because they don't like the tools we use,
then we have a problem. No matter how fancy one can configure thunderbird
rules... (BTW I'm using gmail for Apache Mails and it works pretty well.
It's the only way I can have the same filters on all of my devices...)

I like Benson's idea of improving the searching facilities. But IMHO this
is addressing only part of the story. As I said before, what I love about
github is, that everything is integrated with the code. ASF is about the
code. If there where no code, there wouldn't be any discussions. I don't
think it would be to hard for infra to host a gitlab instance [1] or even
get a github enterprise plan [2]. Everything would run on ASF infra, code
would be integrated. I would be happy. We could set it up so that it sends
an email to a mailing list for every code change/comment/ticket. Win Win
situation ;-)

Best regards,


2015-01-19 6:41 GMT+01:00 Ross Gardler (MS OPEN TECH) <>:

> I'll certainly admit that I'm a "traditionalist". But I hope that I can be
> credited with trying other things when they come along.
> Unfortunately, there is no other format of communications that is
> standards based and thus has all the necessary tools for being productive.
> If there were I'd be happy to use it.
> My car has a cassette player, but I haven't owned a cassette for something
> like 25 years.
> I do think that something better than email will emerge one day, but it
> isn't around today.
> Ross
> Sent from my Windows Phone
> ________________________________
> From: Dennis E. Hamilton<>
> Sent: ‎1/‎18/‎2015 9:20 AM
> To:<>
> Subject: RE: Mailinglists - a tool from the 90s?
> I think Ross's consideration also applies to the many folks who cling to
> technology of the 70s (i.e., the Internet versions of News Readers) to
> access and contribute to ASF mailing lists.
>  - Dennis
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Ross Gardler (MS OPEN TECH) []
> Sent: Sunday, January 18, 2015 07:29
> To:
> Subject: RE: Mailinglists - a tool from the 90s?
> For me any alternative would still have to push everything into my inbox
> where I can use a my preferred tools, each developed and matured over many
> years, to help me process the volume of communications I need (filters,
> archives, calendars etc.)
> Ross
> Sent from my Windows Phone
> ________________________________
> From: Benedikt Ritter<>
> Sent: ‎1/‎18/‎2015 4:35 AM
> To:<>
> Subject: Mailinglists - a tool from the 90s?
> Hi all,
> over at the Apache Commons Project, we have a long discussion about our
> mailing lists. Are they to noisy? Should they be splitted up into sublists?
> Should individual components go TLP?
> IMHO Ben McCann summed up the core problem pretty well [1]. Mailing lists
> are simply a outdated tool from the 90s. They can not compete with tools
> like github/gitlab that integrate the code with the possibility to do code
> reviews, disucssions and bugtracking.
> Now I'm curious: Does anybody here really like the use of mailing lists? Or
> do we all simply go through the struggle of setting up filters etc. just
> because this is the way it has always been?
> Regards,
> Benedikt
> [1]
> --


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