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Date: Tue, 08 Jul 2014 14:05:27 +0300
From: Issac Goldstand <margol@beamartyr.net>
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To: dev@community.apache.org
Subject: Re: Proposing for Apache Member?
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Pierre,

There's a lot of talking around the point going on here.

As Jan has pointed out, there's no way that members (at least the one
needed to nominate) would avoid being aware of someone with potential
merit to be voted in.

There are enough members spread out through the various lists to catch
them - I don't imagine that there is a single list hosted by the ASF
that at least one member isn't watching.  If only because lists are
backed by PMCs and every PMC chair is a member.

But out of curiosity, who are you interested in having nominated, based
on what merit, and to what cause?

  Issac

On 08/07/2014 13:56, jan i wrote:
> On 8 July 2014 12:34, Pierre Smits <pierre.smits@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
>> HI Rob,
>>
>> Thank you for your prompt reply.
>>
>> How would a ASF member become aware of potentials, if it weren't brought to
>> their attention by others? Should they read-up on every mailing list
>> available to establish such awareness for themselves? I don't regard such
>> as feasible.
>>
> 
> Actually it is quite the other way round. Member care pr. definition for
> the foundation itself a.o. if a person start doing foundation work, how can
> members avoid seeing that.
> 
> Let me give you some examples:
> - Help with apacheCon (submit/review talks, organize the event
> - Help with infra work or our other cross project works (legal, marketing
> ....)
> - Take part in apache wide discussions (like the one we just had about
> release cycles)
> - Help maintain the Apache web pages
> and the list goes on. When you do work in these fields members do see you.
> A person who was not openly involved in some of these things would problaly
> not be noticed, but does such a person work for the foundation ?
> 
> You have exactly the same behaivour at PMC/committer level. You dont get
> voted in as PMC because other committers recommend you, but because the PMC
> see and acknowledge that you work for the whole project.
> 
> just my 2ct
> jan I
> 
> 
> I would say that bringing potentials to the awareness of ASF Members is
>> acceptable behaviour for anyone who has the Apache Way in his/her heart.
>>
> 
> 
>>
>> Like you could have guessed, I am not a member. Therefore, I don't have a
>> say in what the by-laws of the ASF must be. But, in the spirit of community
>> development - and the ASF is a community) we could set up a discussion
>> whether or not article 4.1 should be extended in such a way that
>> nominations by others (than members) can be submitted, and whether or not
>> such nominations should be accompanied by a notice of sponsorship by an
>> existing ASF Member.
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Pierre Smits
>>
>> *ORRTIZ.COM <http://www.orrtiz.com>*
>> Services & Solutions for Cloud-
>> Based Manufacturing, Professional
>> Services and Retail & Trade
>> http://www.orrtiz.com
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Jul 8, 2014 at 11:41 AM, Rob Vesse <rvesse@dotnetrdf.org> wrote:
>>
>>> Pierre
>>>
>>> Not unless one/more of those contributors is themselves a Member/Officer
>>> of the ASF - see Sectopn 4.1 of the Bylaws
>>> (http://apache.org/foundation/bylaws.html#4.1) which states the
>> following:
>>>
>>> To be eligible for membership, a person or entity must be nominated by a
>>> current member of the corporation and must complete a written membership
>>> application in such form as shall be adopted by the Board of Directors
>>> from time to time
>>>
>>>
>>> Therefore contributors of a project can't directly, I guess they could
>>> talk to ASF members they know and suggest that person with the aim of
>>> getting a nomination but not being a member myself I'm not sure if that
>>> would be acceptable behaviour.  Ultimately ASF is a meritocracy and my
>>> personal impression based on people who I know of who've become members
>> in
>>> the past couple of years is that to become a member you need to be active
>>> across the foundation (not just within a small part of it) for a
>> prolonged
>>> period.
>>>
>>> One thing worth asking is why the community you are involved in feels the
>>> need to have someone be elected as a Member?
>>>
>>> Rob
>>>
>>> On 08/07/2014 09:43, "Pierre Smits" <pierre.smits@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi All,
>>>>
>>>> Is it possible that contributors of a project can propose a community
>>>> member to be elected as an Apache Member?
>>>>
>>>> Regards,
>>>>
>>>> Pierre Smits
>>>>
>>>> *ORRTIZ.COM <http://www.orrtiz.com>*
>>>> Services & Solutions for Cloud-
>>>> Based Manufacturing, Professional
>>>> Services and Retail & Trade
>>>> http://www.orrtiz.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>