From dev-return-169821-archive-asf-public=cust-asf.ponee.io@commons.apache.org Tue Feb 12 16:49:15 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: archive-asf-public@cust-asf.ponee.io Delivered-To: archive-asf-public@cust-asf.ponee.io Received: from mail.apache.org (hermes.apache.org [140.211.11.3]) by mx-eu-01.ponee.io (Postfix) with SMTP id 968B5180675 for ; Tue, 12 Feb 2019 17:49:14 +0100 (CET) Received: (qmail 19094 invoked by uid 500); 12 Feb 2019 16:49:13 -0000 Mailing-List: contact dev-help@commons.apache.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Post: List-Id: Reply-To: "Commons Developers List" Delivered-To: mailing list dev@commons.apache.org Received: (qmail 18751 invoked by uid 99); 12 Feb 2019 16:49:12 -0000 Received: from pnap-us-west-generic-nat.apache.org (HELO spamd4-us-west.apache.org) (209.188.14.142) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Tue, 12 Feb 2019 16:49:12 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by spamd4-us-west.apache.org (ASF Mail Server at spamd4-us-west.apache.org) with ESMTP id 75763C2244 for ; Tue, 12 Feb 2019 16:49:12 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at spamd4-us-west.apache.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.2 tagged_above=-999 required=6.31 tests=[DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=disabled Authentication-Results: spamd4-us-west.apache.org (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=eitanadler.com Received: from mx1-lw-eu.apache.org ([10.40.0.8]) by localhost (spamd4-us-west.apache.org [10.40.0.11]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Dei6abc9OjM3 for ; Tue, 12 Feb 2019 16:49:09 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-yw1-f47.google.com (mail-yw1-f47.google.com [209.85.161.47]) by mx1-lw-eu.apache.org (ASF Mail Server at mx1-lw-eu.apache.org) with ESMTPS id 1C85760E31 for ; Tue, 12 Feb 2019 16:40:56 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-yw1-f47.google.com with SMTP id u205so1262473ywe.1 for ; Tue, 12 Feb 2019 08:40:56 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=eitanadler.com; s=0xdeadbeef; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :content-transfer-encoding; bh=rjpANG+LYooKy8LJwnfYXEQptp5J0DvXaKlakVoKBkg=; b=nBMH9Vdo99iooA1arqFTI8rQpRaFi03eK6jblE6CNpS4+RHAFwJFfNIC8u6gDckgkI MeMZTmv3kcPHU3R9VyA913aVkVLJ/LBYS/32ztFp/b4KnJJcWyNqiLEzPzkS7Ut7xByK phSonLOAHVXaFUdYmtXUrsktlAshG6iL1QURE= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=rjpANG+LYooKy8LJwnfYXEQptp5J0DvXaKlakVoKBkg=; b=iMe5VJtIO1IVCKuTn80V4Gp4dlc+oMilM8SEQA3gYKbM2xKaGgx0QdWCxqEY9YNF54 wSfLr7MeF4bYLazEdSkbtBQjyOxO0TjkfP6vrhpWzESH0sb5tLG1MYY1x1lX6hF4h4pb A8PaYRykk8oyEV1DMuInrGLLZHol5GIc4HhL7SDgkDCM6Xf5Lk4gawzB/mofX51LArC2 4z4ep+vr4Imr5yIorG5JYJh3xWnCCfDQBQjyZzEyuXRau4VlCT1D6C7EFuCnm8xGy08v aNvAdGZDjJYsVkNa/mUic7F3qGanSgXjd2hCIrtBL4uamWKqiFoE0JIZ38zkjEFtacqQ MLMw== X-Gm-Message-State: AHQUAubDXqbBRT6suxDnpmBT5tjVRMbCEm4UzeI3Z9feg9lojrvUF7M2 1a89+iGe0cNu2b7kWUQdN1WA+EHuO/+XvcZRoEO4tU7zzN4kJw== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AHgI3IaOIuc2TWx/vM8dUevGcZf0MJoRYxS31tl3Hw2yP68nomVHaCG3mba3RAz04flK/wDjA3HjotE36Tkunwk/9es= X-Received: by 2002:a81:5d55:: with SMTP id r82mr762273ywb.213.1549989655436; Tue, 12 Feb 2019 08:40:55 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Eitan Adler Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2019 08:40:29 -0800 Message-ID: Subject: Re: Reply-To settings (was: [vote] fix the misconfiguration of the dev@ mailing list) To: Commons Developers List Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable (please make sure to add me to the CC as the mailing list is presently brok= en) On Mon, 11 Feb 2019 at 07:08, sebb wrote: > > On Mon, 11 Feb 2019 at 12:33, Gilles Sadowski wrot= e: > > > > Le lun. 11 f=C3=A9vr. 2019 =C3=A0 11:16, sebb a =C3= =A9crit : > > > > > > On Mon, 11 Feb 2019 at 09:24, Gilles Sadowski = wrote: > > > > > > > > Hi. > > > > > > > > Le lun. 11 f=C3=A9vr. 2019 =C3=A0 10:02, sebb a = =C3=A9crit : > > > > > > > > > > I checked a few other ASF lists and they all have Reply-To set ei= ther > > > > > to the current list or to dev@ for lists such as commits@ and > > > > > notifications@ > > > > > > > > I had a look at that too. > > > > But IMO > > > > * "dev" and > > > > * "commits", "notifications", ... > > > > are different cases in that the former relays messages that origina= ted > > > > from real people while the latter comes from a "bot" and it would m= ake > > > > no sense to reply to it. > > > > > > Yes. That's deliberate, for the reason you state. > > > The point is that all the lists have Reply-To set. > > > > Sorry, I don't follow the reasoning; why should the setting be > > the same for two different cases? > > Huh? > > The setting is not the same. > > They all have Reply-To set, however as I wrote, the actual setting is > not the same for all the cases. There are two different things: - having reply-to set - having reply-to munged The former happens by the user. The latter is changed by the mailing list. The right thing to do for commits@ is to have the *bot itself* set "reply-to" to the list and for the list to do nothing. On Mon, 11 Feb 2019 at 13:19, Gilles Sadowski wrote: > > A message intended for the list that > is sent privately, or one intended to be private that is sent to a public > list?] Not exactly. In the broken case, public messages also run the risk of getting ignored. This is because replies don't go to the user and thus look like ordinary messages. As an example: I get an average of 200 messages per day from public mailing lists. Unless a message is marked as "to me" or "I participated" it is much more likely to be missed. The tradeoffs are: Non-broken Pros: - Doesn't break the expectation of "reply" vs "reply all" - Private messages are not likely to go a public mailing list - No need to manually add people to CC - Messages are less likely to be lost to the author - Following internet standards - Similar to other open source projects Cons: - Its possible to accidentally sent a private reply which will need to be redirected to the mailing list. Broken Pros: - It takes slightly more work to send a private reply which will need to be redirected to the mailing list. --=20 Eitan Adler --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@commons.apache.org