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From Stephen Colebourne <scolebou...@joda.org>
Subject Re: [all] Java 9 module names
Date Sun, 23 Apr 2017 14:43:58 GMT
I've never used that myself, but  don't see anything similar.
Remember though that JPMS isn't trying to replace Maven. It just
intends there to be a reliable set of modules when running in the
platform.
Stephen


On 23 April 2017 at 08:57, Ralph Goers <ralph.goers@dslextreme.com> wrote:
> How does the module system support Maven’s runtime scope?
>
> Ralph
>
>> On Apr 21, 2017, at 10:48 PM, Stephen Colebourne <scolebourne@joda.org> wrote:
>>
>> See http://blog.joda.org/2017/04/java-9-modules-jpms-basics.html and
>> https://www.slideshare.net/scolebourne/java-se-9-modules-jpms-an-introduction
>>
>> Basically, you need "requires static" for optional dependencies. The
>> exception if for a module where the dependency is an annotation where
>> you don't need the annotation to be present at runtime. eg. @NonNull
>> from FindBugs
>>
>> Depending on things that haven't been modularized yet is risky. It is
>> allowed however, and its known as "automatic modules". Basically, it
>> looks exactly like a normal "requires" clause, its just that you are
>> _guessing_ what the module name of the dependency will be!
>>
>> This is why I started this thread. By saying _now_what the module name
>> will be, you greatly reduce the chance of people guessing wrongly.
>> Getting everyone to usesuper-package reverse DNS naming helps too.
>>
>> Stephen
>>
>>
>> On 22 April 2017 at 02:11, Ralph Goers <ralph.goers@dslextreme.com> wrote:
>>> On to the next question - which I apologize for asking as it may not apply to
Commons.  Log4j has lots of optional components to support lots of third party stuff (some
ASF projects and some not). How do we handle things that haven’t yet been modularized? Normally
I would expect to have requires directives.
>>>
>>> Ralph
>>>
>>>> On Apr 21, 2017, at 6:04 PM, Ralph Goers <ralph.goers@dslextreme.com>
wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Thanks for taking a look Stephen. I appreciate the guidance. I will be sure
to submit a PR when I get something going with Log4j 2.
>>>>
>>>> Ralph
>>>>
>>>>> On Apr 21, 2017, at 3:01 PM, Stephen Colebourne <scolebourne@joda.org>
wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Some rules:
>>>>> - Each module contains a set of packages, each of which must be
>>>>> specified explicitly.
>>>>> - Modules depend on other modules, but must not form a cycle of dependencies.
>>>>> - No package can be in two modules
>>>>>
>>>>> Looking at the Javadoc here -
>>>>> https://logging.apache.org/log4j/2.x/javadoc.html - it seems like each
>>>>> jar file has a separate set of packages it contains, with an obvious
>>>>> super-package for each jar file*. Furthermore, the super-packages of
>>>>> the jar files do not clash, so I think you are fine in naming terms.
>>>>> What I can't be sure from the Javadoc is whether there is a cycle of
>>>>> dependencies.
>>>>>
>>>>> Possible modules:
>>>>> - org.apache.logging.log4j
>>>>> - org.apache.logging.log4j.core
>>>>> - org.apache.logging.log4j.io
>>>>> - org.apache.logging.log4j.taglib
>>>>> - org.apache.logging.log4j.jcl
>>>>> - org.apache.logging.log4j.jul
>>>>> - org.apache.logging.log4j.flume.appender
>>>>> - org.apache.logging.log4j.jmx.gui
>>>>> - org.apache.logging.log4j.web
>>>>> - org.apache.logging.log4j.nosql.appender
>>>>>
>>>>> * the slf4j bridge is problematic, but is being addressed by changes
in slf4j.
>>>>> * the logf4 v1 bridge probably can't be modularized
>>>>>
>>>>> Bernd has addressed the point about the need to export all packages
>>>>> individually, allowing the modules above.
>>>>>
>>>>> Stephen
>>>>>
>>>>> On 21 April 2017 at 21:34, Ralph Goers <ralph.goers@dslextreme.com>
wrote:
>>>>>> I am having a hard time figuring out how Log4j is going to be able
to support this.  The API itself is in org.apache.logging.log4j and some packages under that.
 All the main implementation is under org.apache.logging.log4j.core.  These obviously overlap.
 Most of our other jars have packages that are in org.apache.logging.log4j.xxx where xxx matches
the jar name.  We aren’t going to change the API to support modules.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Is there some reasonable way around this?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Ralph
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Apr 21, 2017, at 6:16 AM, Stephen Colebourne <scolebourne@joda.org>
wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 21 April 2017 at 13:59, sebb <sebbaz@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>> What happens when there is a API break which necessitates
a package name change?
>>>>>>>> I assume that the module name will also need to change to
the new super-package.
>>>>>>>> e.g.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Commons-Lang4
>>>>>>>> -> super-package org.apache.commons.lang4
>>>>>>>> -> module org.apache.commons.lang4
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Yes, thats right.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> AFAICT Commons generally has obvious and unique super-packages
for
>>>>>>>> each component.
>>>>>>>> This should make it easier than for larger projects with
lots of jars
>>>>>>>> and potentially overlapping package names.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> However even Commons has some code that uses a different
package structure.
>>>>>>>> e.g. NET uses examples as the super-package.
>>>>>>>> This includes working examples that are included in the release.
>>>>>>>> I guess that will have to change (which is probably a good
idea anyway).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Yes, as it stands, [net] would be a bad modular citizen, because
it
>>>>>>> exposes the "examples" package, and thus prevents any other module
>>>>>>> from using that package. Just move it to
>>>>>>> org.apache.commons.net.examples.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Stephen
>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
>>>>>
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>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
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>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
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>>
>
>
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