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From Henri Yandell <>
Subject Re: [CHALLENGE] Move All of Commons to the Dormant
Date Sat, 19 Oct 2013 15:22:24 GMT
On Sat, Oct 19, 2013 at 7:25 AM, Christian Grobmeier <>wrote:

> On 18 Oct 2013, at 9:24, Jörg Schaible wrote:
>  Hi Christian,
>> Christian Grobmeier wrote:
>>  On 17 Oct 2013, at 18:12, Paul Benedict wrote:
>>>  I am glad to hear being "dormant" is not the same thing as being in
>>>> the
>>>> "attic"
>>> Why?
>> Because "attic" means more or less that we not even intend to work on this
>> component anymore. E.g. we decided that we will not put any further effort
>> into oro, because it has been outdated by the JDK.
> Being in the attic is NOT a permanent thing. Get active developers, leave
> the attic. If a project doesn't make any sense, stay in the attic.
> We are having an attic but called it "dormant".

The difference is that we have a a piece of code that no one is working on
now and call it dormant. We are still here. The attic is when there is no
one at Apache being responsible for the code. One of our development
patterns is to swarm on different components which means that other, still
looked after codebases, receive less attention while we're swarming on
another component. Dormant fits nicely here.

>  Unmaintained projects are a potential risk for our users. With having a
>>> dormant
>>> state we replicate the attic. I don't see a difference between a dormant
>>> component and one in the attic - except that the term "attic" is more
>>> established (as in foundation wide)
>>> as the term "dormant".
>> It simply means that no one is currently actively working on it, but it
>> tells you nothing about its maturity or feature completeness. However, if
>> we
>> get a security report on one of this components, I am quite sure that we
>> will react with a new release in time.
> Given that normal releases will take a long time at Commons I doubt.
> There is a security issue for this dormant components JavaDoc:
> Nobody reacted (includes me).

Sounds like Attic.

>  And any (Apache) committer with interest can revive development quite
>> immediately. It might be more
>> difficult for users, but if one has interest and starts to bring
>> reasonable
>> patches, we were always quite lenient with committer status. I doubt, that
>> we would see here any development for collections 4.x, if we had moved it
>> into "attic". Especially because the term "attic" and its meaning is more
>> established.
> Attic components can be revived similar quickly. Nobody said we need to
> delete any reference
> from our webpages and prevent any collaboration with others.

Attic components are marked as read only. We don't take new user reports,
they don't have a mailing list, their website has a big banner saying
'attic'. So moving out of the Attic involves the infrastructure changes to
make something writeable again. There's also a difference in that dormant
components accumulate new issues to work on.

Attic: The conversation at Apache has been turned off until such a time as
demand returns and we have to find a new place for conversation.
Dormant: Things are just quiet, and ready to return as demand returns.

The challenge is to not be sloppy and pretend that every component is 'just
quiet' and is ready to return when the need is great (the King Arthur
pattern :) ).


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