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From Gary Gregory <GGreg...@seagullsoftware.com>
Subject RE: New Sandbox Component Proposal: Commons JSON
Date Thu, 30 Apr 2009 16:37:00 GMT
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Matt Benson [mailto:gudnabrsam@yahoo.com]
> Sent: Thursday, April 30, 2009 8:59 AM
> To: Commons Developers List
> Subject: Re: New Sandbox Component Proposal: Commons JSON
> 
> 
> 
> 
> --- On Thu, 4/30/09, Christian Grobmeier <grobmeier@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> > From: Christian Grobmeier <grobmeier@gmail.com>
> > Subject: Re: New Sandbox Component Proposal: Commons JSON
> > To: "Commons Developers List" <dev@commons.apache.org>
> > Date: Thursday, April 30, 2009, 9:55 AM
> > > Why do you consider a dependency
> > on Antlr a negative (the runtime is 148k), JSON is a
> > formally defined language after all.
> >
> > I don't know a person face to face who actually can handle
> > antlr. Its
> > a cool tool, but if you need to create a patch for your
> > json lib, it
> > can be hell. Plain java is understood by every java
> > developer (well,
> > most ;-)).
> >
> 
> I don't know about folks you (or I) know face-to-face, but I know that
> several ASF committers and members have popped up around the ANTLR lists
> over the years, including, off the top of my head, myself, Torsten,
> O.Ziegermann, H.L. Ship, and probably others.  I personally am quite
> comfortable with ANTLR 2.x but need to really take the time to play with
> ANTLR 3.  The argument _for_ using parser generators is that those who use
> them feel the grammar is easier to digest (it's smaller) than the
> equivalent Java code.  It's something else again to debug ANTLR
> parsers/treeparsers, but it's far from impossible.  Once you get used to
> knowing what to look for it's actually fairly easy.  I don't say any of
> this to disparage Yonik's work on Noggit (I've not looked at it); I am
> just airing my understanding of the motivations for using grammars and
> parser generators as opposed to hand-writing parsers.

Well, at least, there seems to be some JSON Antlr grammars out there already. 

Now if I could just find one for COBOL (no, not kidding.)

Gary

> 
> -Matt
> 
> > > I always scratch my head when I hear "there are
> > dependencies!" when any application I create or use always
> > has dependencies. I wonder how much redundancies and bug
> > fixes would be removed if, for example, all Apache Java code
> > (or even just the Commons code) went the other way and did
> > depend on each other. You might argue we would end up in
> > 'jar hell' but that might force us to better draw boundaries
> > between components and fix bugs :)
> >
> >
> > In maven age I don't feel bad with dependencies, but one
> > json lib did
> > depend on asm version 1 once, and hibernate upgraded to asm
> > version 2,
> > and that gave me nightmare. I ended up with opening my json
> > package
> > and copied all version 1 files into it with own package
> > name. I
> > recompiled, brought this to my repos and so on. This was
> > hell (cause
> > my customer didn't want to pay the time).
> >
> > For me json is so basic, that we can do everything without
> > any
> > dependencie. And a basic lib should not have any, I think.
> >
> > Thanks!
> >
> > Christian
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
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> >
> >
> 
> 
> 
> 
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