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From Al Chou <hotfusion...@yahoo.com>
Subject Re: [math][all] Mentoring for Google's Summer of Code program
Date Fri, 03 Jun 2005 16:49:36 GMT
--- robert burrell donkin <robertburrelldonkin@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:
> On Thu, 2005-06-02 at 22:58 -0700, Al Chou wrote:
> > Questions of scope of Commons-Math aside <gasp>, what is the scope of the
> > summer project?  The scope of Ryan's proposal seems mighty ambitious, even
> if
> > you remove the parts that aren't currently in scope for Commons-Math.  
> 
> i think that it would be useful to separate the question of scope from
> the question of mentoring and community. 
> 
> i definitely agree that the commons-math group is the right one for
> mentoring this code. i also agree (with simon) that jakarta commons is
> the best community for growing this code (whilst math remains here, of
> course). 

+1


> in terms of scope, IMHO there are two separate questions: is the
> proposed codebase in scope for the jakarta-commons and is it in scope
> for the commons-math component. opinions on these questions welcomed :)
> 
> if the codebase is not in scope for jakarta-commons then i'd be willing
> to sponsor this as an incubator project (when it is ready). it could be
> developed in the sandbox until then.
> 
> if the codebase is in scope for jakarta-commons but not in scope for
> commons-math then one solution would be to factor the out-of-scope code
> into a separate component with it's own scope.
> 
> so, i see no reason why the project couldn't be pushed forward whilst
> the questions of scope are argued about.

I think for the project to succeed in any case, its scope will have to be
constrained quite a lot.  Ryan's post that preceded this one seems quite good
in limiting the scope, and I argue that it's close to being in scope for
Commons-Math now.


> > If you
> > intend to stay true to Apache's charter, the code will have to be developed
> > firsthand, not copied from any other source, unless the license of the
> source
> > is compatible or the author(s) are amenable to adding an Apache-compatible
> > alternative license to their code or changing over to an Apache-compatible
> > license.  Coding that much from scratch and providing JUnit tests will be a
> > heck of a lot of work (maybe a little onerous if you do TDD).  And forgive
> my
> > skepticism, but code developed for coursework is unlikely to be as
> bulletproof
> > as the proposal aims for.
> 
> it does sound ambitious (but there's nothing wrong with that)
> 
> IMHO one of the first jobs of the mentors will need to do will be to
> study the proposal and create a realistic core tasks together with a
> more ambitious list of additional tasks. (this should ensure that ryan
> is not unfairly financially penalised for his ambition.) it's hard to
> estimate a priori what the quality and quantity of any code produced by
> ryan will be but i agree that the code will need to satisfy the current
> standards especially in the area of development best practice. the
> mentors will need to work with ryan to ensure that he knows what's
> expected particular when it comes to using code developed by others.
> 
> > Also, specifically what parts of the proposal are not already addressed by
> > existing libraries such as Colt?  I thought we were over the licensing
> hurdle
> > for Colt, so anything it already does probably should not be duplicated by
> code
> > newly written for the proposed project.
> > 
> > All the above said, I'm not trying to be discouraging, and in fact I would
> be
> > willing to participate in mentoring (I'll probably learn something new
> > myself!).  I just want reasonable expectations and goals to be set.  And
> > perhaps we can all ride the wave of youthful exuberance to grow a library
> that
> > looks like the beginning of an "Apache-Math-Java".
> 
> +1
> 
> :)

<g> back at ya.


Al


		
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