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From Jeff Dever <>
Subject Re: [VOTE] Create new commons-httpclient-dev mailing list
Date Fri, 02 Aug 2002 00:09:12 GMT
Speaking as the httpclient release manager, there is no plans to move httpclient
to become a top level project at this time.  After a 2.0 release, a promotion
may be considered, but for now it is somthing I would vote against.

There are two reasons for this in my mind:
1) HttpClient is a library, not an application, and fits well under the commons
mantra.  It is "common" and thus may never make sense to be top level (needs
debate, but not now).
2) The last release of HttpClient was alpha1 10 months ago: we need to show more
consistancy than that to qualify as top level IMO and to make a quality
statement which currently cannot be made or we would be at 2.0 already.

Somone else brought up the issue of voting.  Lets recap the important points of
all this list seperation:
1) Insulate the commons-dev list from the high volume of httpclient traffic
2) Insulate the new httpclient-dev list from commons-dev (follows from 1)
3) Dont exclude anyone from voting on important issues in any commons project

The big concern here is that we not want to exclude commons committers from
votes on httpclient issues.  A vote is a good way to say, "hey, somthing
important is happening" and we want input from everyone, not just httpclient
contributors.  Some might say that if you really cared about httpclient enough
to vote, that you would join the list anyway so as to be informed.

Nor do  httpclient contributors want to miss out on votes for other commons
projects.  Therefore I would have to continue to subscribe to the commons-dev
list and gain no real benefit from having a seperate list (other than historical

I really don't know what the answer here is.  There was a suggestion to have a
dedicated commons-vote list.  Thats not a bad idea for solving this
httpclient/commons list split.  It also would make it easier to tally up the
votes afterwards (which is not easy to do right now in the mirad of different
topics discussed here) and would give a nice vote history in the list archives.

The bottom line is to have reduced list traffic for everyone (and the "just use
a mail filter" does not hold for people that have to pay for bandwitdh) based on
seperation of concerns.  Frankly I would like to see more of the subprojects on
seperate lists so that everyone can pick and choose lists based on concerns.

A vote list makes even more sense in this light.

"Michael A. Smith" wrote:

> As before, I'm -0.
> If httpclient has enough traffic to warrant its own list, maybe the http
> client developers should consider making a proposal to move to a
> top-level jakarta subproject (outside of jakarta commons).  If the
> commits of httpclient don't want to move outside commons, or if
> general@jakarta doesn't accept httpclient as a top-level subproject,
> then I am +1 to creating a httpclient-dev mailing list.
> regards,
> michael
> robert burrell donkin wrote:
> > here's my +1
> >
> > - robert
> >
> > ========
> >
> > create a new mailing list for httpclient development discussions.
> >
> > AIM
> > ===
> >
> > reduce traffic on commons-dev.
> >
> >
> > --
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> > <>
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> > <>
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