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From Henri Yandell <>
Subject Re: [VOTE] Create new commons-sandbox-dev mailing list
Date Tue, 30 Jul 2002 17:46:13 GMT

I'm not convinced it will work. It's entire aim appears to be to enable
developers who are not working on sandboxed projects from having to listen
to any discussion on sandboxed projects.

Any listener to sandbox will still have to listen to the main commons due
to the vote.

There are a bunch of negatives, firstly the developers of the proejcts
solely in Commons will have no clue about what is coming in the sandbox.
They would have no planning in place to adjust to depend on this and might
sit and reinvent the wheel.

Secondly, they would have no context when a vote happened. No idea as to
whether it's a quick submission or a long drawn out submission of buggy
code or somewhere in between.

Thirdly, they would not be able to be involved in half of the
conversations. Where would I have a conversation about a plan to merge the
IO and Net projects? It makes sense that developers on 'proper' Commons
have more experience in Commons than those in the sandbox, so this
proposal removes that experience from being available to new projects.

Fourthly, quiet sandbox projects like Util, Codec, Modeler, will happily
vanish further from people's view.

Lastly, any archive searches will have to check both lists to find out
information on a project.

I'm going to have to be a -1 on this one.

I'd prefer to just see a system in which, say Vfs knows it will involve a
lot of communication, then they get a jakarta-commons-sandbox-vfs mail
list or something to do their spammy discussion on.


On Tue, 30 Jul 2002, robert burrell donkin wrote:

> this part of my previous proposal seems to enjoy consensus support so i'd
> like to move to a vote.
> here's my +1
> ========
> create a new mailing list called 'commons-sandbox-dev'. this list would
> host development discussions for sandbox components. standard commons
> rules about prefixing with the component name would still apply. votes for
> the promotion of sandbox components and so on would still happen on
> commons-dev.
> =========
> the primary aim of this move is to allow jakarta committers to discuss
> these components without having to subscribe to the high traffic
> commons-dev list. the secondary aim is to reduce traffic on the common-dev
> list.
> - robert
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