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From "James Strachan" <james_strac...@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject Re: RESEND -> Re: [SUBMIT] [jelly] tag library for prompting users forinformation
Date Tue, 23 Jul 2002 10:11:08 GMT
I got the one before; though these days I struggle to keep up with
commons-dev and it sometimes takes me a while to responsd...

I hear you about the seperation of <label> and <input>.

Though from an XML perspective, you should try to not use XML attributes for
text which might one day use markup. So, (say) one day we might want to
create some kinda a UI implementation of the 'form' tags that allowed simple
bold/italic/font markup in the labels. You can't really do that in an
attribute value. Though I don't like the fact that we'd have to generate IDs
for each label.

My main point really was just about the naming of the elements & attributes;
that it'd be nice if we could use more HTML-ish names that was all. How
about if we did this, where we allow labels to be specified as an attribute
or as a child element...

<form>
    <input id="bar" type="password" label="please enter a password: "/>

    <input id="foo" type="text">
      <label>Please enter a foo:</label>
   </input>
</form>

This would also let folks wrap label contents in CDATA sections if required
too. So we don't have to do a full HTML form thing, just use similar names
for the core controls (input) and allow label to be an attribute or a child
element?

James
----- Original Message -----
From: "John Casey" <jdcasey@00java.com>
To: "Jakarta Commons Developers List" <commons-dev@jakarta.apache.org>
Sent: Tuesday, July 23, 2002 1:08 AM
Subject: RESEND -> Re: [SUBMIT] [jelly] tag library for prompting users
forinformation


I'm not sure if my MTA is bombing out or what, but it seems like some
messages
are not getting through.  Just in case, I'm re-submitting this reply.
Please
disregard if this got through the first time...





I have to say that I'm not really impressed with the HTML/XHTML 4 form
syntax...I've looked over the w3c recommendation, and it just seems like
any set of properties that belong together logically should be force to
be written together syntactically.  It would be completely legal for the
label and the input to be declared at opposite ends of the form, which
would create two problems:  one, that the rendering becomes somewhat
ambiguous, and two, that maintenance of that section of code would
become infinitely more difficult.  I would propose taking a poll on
this:  if everyone else thinks it's a good idea, I'll implement it
(after all, it is a standard, whatever its quality).  Beyond that, I'm
just not convinced that this would make a particular jelly script
implementing a property sheet easier to comprehend / maintain...

Please let me know what you think on this...

Regards,
John

On Fri, 2002-07-19 at 11:59, James Strachan wrote:
> Thanks for that John - it all makes much more sense now.
>
> Just a thought - and this is kinda wacky.
>
> How about making these tags look a bit more like the familiar HTML markup
> tags (or XHTML form tags)?
>
> http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/interact/forms.html
>
> e.g.
>
> <form>
>     <label for="foo">Please enter a foo: </label>
>     <input id="foo" type="text"/>
>
>     <label for="bar">Now a password:: </label>
>     <input id="bar" type="password"/>
> </form>
>
> Then the implementation of the tags could either be a command line
interface
> to forms, do Swing stuff or even pop up an XUL page in (say) Mozilla
> browser, or a HTML browser. The nice bit about this approach is that the
> snippet of XML would then be reusable across Jelly, HTML and even XUL.
>
> All it would really mean is a minor renaming of the tags and attributes.
>
> James
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "John Casey" <jdcasey@00java.com>
> To: "Jakarta Commons Developers List" <commons-dev@jakarta.apache.org>
> Sent: Friday, July 19, 2002 5:16 PM
> Subject: Re: [SUBMIT] [jelly] tag library for prompting users for
> information
>
>
> well I sent this one last night before the non-jar file, but I'll send
> it again in case something else was messed up...
>
> Thanks,
> John
>
>
>
> On Fri, 2002-07-19 at 10:16, James Strachan wrote:
> > Thanks. John do you have an example Jelly script to show how these tags
> are
> > meant to be used?
> >
> > James
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "John Casey" <jdcasey@00java.com>
> > To: "Jakarta Commons Developers List" <commons-dev@jakarta.apache.org>
> > Sent: Friday, July 19, 2002 3:07 PM
> > Subject: Re: [SUBMIT] [jelly] tag library for prompting users for
> > information
> >
> >
> > *sigh*
> >
> > Sorry for the spam, but here's the real jar...I'm still working out how
> > the Jar functionality works from within NetBeans, apparently.  Sorry
> > again.
> >
> > John
> >
> >
> >
> > On Fri, 2002-07-19 at 05:37, James Strachan wrote:
> > > I think that JAR you sent is empty :-)
> > >
> > > James
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "John Casey" <jdcasey@00java.com>
> > > To: "Jakarta Commons Developers List" <commons-dev@jakarta.apache.org>
> > > Sent: Friday, July 19, 2002 6:33 AM
> > > Subject: Re: [SUBMIT] [jelly] tag library for prompting users for
> > > information
> > >
> > >
> > > FYI-
> > >
> > > I have included some minor changes to the package structures for the
> > > interact stuff, along with a proof-of-concept for adapting it to Ant.
> > >
> > > It's not all that well documented in all cases, but I'll clean that up
> > > eventually.
> > >
> > > Also, I've added to requested ability to override the gui display mode
> > > in favor of a console-only mode.
> > >
> > > The attribute for this is consoleOnly='true' ...
> > >
> > > Regards,
> > > John
> > >
> > >
> > > On Thu, 2002-07-18 at 22:49, John Casey wrote:
> > > > I've included a test jelly script.  You can test it normally using
> > > > Windows, etc. but currently the only easy way to test the console
> > > > version of things is to have Linux or something and run it on non-X
> mode
> > > > like runlevel 3 or something.
> > > >
> > > > I would like to integrate an override switch for forced-console
mode,
> > > > however...I'll look into that tomorrow first thing.
> > > >
> > > > Also, I'd like to take a second and mention a couple of features I
> > > > forgot about until now:
> > > >
> > > > - Option on the property-sheet to store results to file.
> > > > - Option to provide autofill.properties for automation of otherwise
> > > > interactive executions, so that default values are automatically
used
> > > > instead of prompting and waiting forever.
> > > >
> > > > Anyway, here's the test script that I used...see what you think.
> > > >
> > > > Regards,
> > > > John
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Thu, 2002-07-18 at 17:46, Stéphane MOR wrote:
> > > > > John Casey wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > >I submitted this once before to the maven-dev list, since I saw
> more
> > > > > >Jelly traffic on that than on commons-dev, but here goes again...
> > > > > >
> > > > > Hi John !
> > > > >
> > > > > Last time you posted that, you forgot the sources ! :-)
> > > > > As I started something identical that on my side, I simply
finished
> it
> > > > > and put it in
> > > > > the org.apache.commons.jelly.interaction package.
> > > > >
> > > > > >I'm attaching the source code for an interaction tag library,
that
> > will
> > > > > >prompt the user for input and save the result to a variable...
> > > > > >
> > > > > By now, there is only an AskTag that asks the user a question, and
> > sets
> > > > > the value
> > > > > to a variable (like yours), which is the basic thing that I would
> > expect
> > > > > from an Interaction thing !
> > > > >
> > > > > >Additional features include:
> > > > > >
> > > > > >- input types: text, password, boolean, numeric text, and
drop-down
> > > list
> > > > > >(comma-separated default value supplied)
> > > > > >
> > > > > I like those ideas, the password is something that we could need,
> and
> > > > > the boolean value
> > > > > is essential in interactive scripts.
> > > > > I thought about a ChoiceTag, which must be the same as you
drop-down
> > > > > list, even if
> > > > > I can't see how my console would show me that drop-down list ...
> > > > >
> > > > > >- auto-detection of GUI-enabled JVM's; console display for
> otherwise
> > > > > >
> > > > > Cool !
> > > > > If my JVM is GUI-enabled and if I don't want any GUI, do I have a
> way
> > to
> > > > > disable it somehow ?
> > > > >
> > > > > >- solid domain object model backing tags, to promote
extensibility
> > and
> > > > > >reimplementation into Ant task
> > > > > >
> > > > > hmmm, I need more infos there, I should find that in the sources
:-)
> > > > >
> > > > > >The source files here are [mostly] well-documented.  I'm posting
> them
> > > > > >here with the hope that they will be integrated into the Jelly
> > project,
> > > > > >so that I can maintain them as a standard part of the Jelly tool.
> > > > > >
> > > > > I'd love to help you to integrate that, as I feel that it's
> something
> > > > > that can be very
> > > > > valuable.
> > > > >
> > > > > Cheers,
> > > > > Stéphane
> > > > >
> > > > > ___________________________________________________________
> > > > > Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français
!
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> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > ----
> > > >
> > >
> > > > <?xml version="1.0"?>
> > > >
> > > > <j:jelly xmlns:j="jelly:core"
> > > >
> >
xmlns:i="jelly:org.apache.commons.jelly.tags.interact.InteractTagLibrary"
> > > > xmlns:a="jelly:ant">
> > > >
> > > >   start
> > > >
> > > >   <i:property-sheet>
> > > >     <i:property key="pull_cvs" prompt="Pull new source files from
CVS"
> > > type='boolean'/>
> > > >     <i:property key="phase" prompt="Build phase" type='drop-down'
> > > defaultValue='one,two,three' />
> > > >     <i:property key="retries" prompt="Maximum retries"
type='numeric'
> > > defaultValue='3' />
> > > >     <i:property key="config_file" prompt="Path of config file"
> > type='text'
> > > />
> > > >     <i:property key="password" prompt="Web server password"
> > > type='password' />
> > > >   </i:property-sheet>
> > > >
> > > >   Pulling from CVS? ${pull_cvs}
> > > >   Build Phase: ${phase}
> > > >   Maximum Retries: ${retries}
> > > >   Using Config File: ${config_file}
> > > >   Using Password: ${password}
> > > >
> > > >   end
> > > >
> > > >   <a:echo message="done..."/>
> > > >
> > > > </j:jelly>
> > > >
> > > > ----
> > > >
> > >
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> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
>
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