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From "Paulo Gaspar" <paulo.gas...@krankikom.de>
Subject RE: [Logging] [VOTE] Commons Logging 1.0 Release
Date Fri, 01 Feb 2002 23:38:23 GMT
I agree with all that Berin says.

He also mentioned what I think is the critical factor for
Avalon coherence: a more homogeneous "culture" even across
their audience/users.


Have fun,
Paulo Gaspar

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Berin Loritsch [mailto:bloritsch@apache.org]
> Sent: Saturday, February 02, 2002 12:09 AM
> 
> Paulo Gaspar wrote:
> 
> >>-----Original Message-----
> >>From: Peter Donald [mailto:peter@apache.org]
> >>Sent: Friday, February 01, 2002 11:21 PM
> >>
> >>...
> >>
> >>Avalon is no more or less coherent than Commons.
> >>
> >>...
> >>
> > 
> > Even if you say so, I keep thinking that Avalon is more 
> > coherent than the commons in many respects.
> > 
> > And I also think this is one of the reasons that makes it
> > interesting to have both around.
> 
> 
> I guess the coherency perceived is that all the components
> in Avalon's Excalibur (since this is closest to Commons) all
> have a purpose towards some level of server programming.  Some
> were born from Matt Welsh's SEDA concepts (those are relatively
> new), some were born from Cocoon, and yet others were born from
> Phoenix and JAMES.  We borrow from our users, and our users
> donate to us.  It's a good synergy.  That is where our coherency
> lies.
> 
> I think Commons has a more diverse audience, and a different
> perspective on things.
> 
> For instance, the Avalon community is sold on IOC and SOC (Inversion
> of Control and Separation of Concerns).  Many commons committers have
> their reservations about those patterns.  Those patterns do influence
> all of our code.  Even the stuff that can be ripped out of Excalibur
> and used completely apart from Avalon has those patterns in mind
> when they were designed.  That is why you will rarely see static
> factories for a piece in the system--everything is designed to be
> externally managed.
> 
> I suppose there is another point of coherency.  But I'm just talking
> now, so I'll shut up.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> 
> "They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety
>   deserve neither liberty nor safety."
>                  - Benjamin Franklin
> 
> 
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