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From Miloslaw Smyk <>
Subject Re: Design of web apps based on Cocoon
Date Sun, 10 Sep 2000 12:30:37 GMT

Steve Conover wrote:
> > database --> ESQL --> XSP --> XSL --> result
> Aren't esql and xsp in the same layer?  esql is just a taglib and gets
> thrown in with all the other xsp stuff, i.e. you don't get the results of
> your esql queries at the xsp stage, rather that's the stage where you're
> defining those queries.

Right. I've been testing SQL Processor and old SQL taglib, too, and it's
probably the SQL Processor I had in mind when I wrote the above. So it
should rather be

database --> (ESQL + XSP) --> XSL --> result

as it is right now.

> Actually I've kinda honed in on wht I think is a good interpretation of mvc
> as it applies to xsp.
> content (xml) --> xsp/sql --> sql results cleanup (xsl) --> controller (xsl)
> --> view (xsl)

One question -- what exactly do you mean by "sql results cleanup"?
Formatting results wrt expectations of further layers? Removing unnecessary
things? Couldn't that be handled with proper SQL queries? Or do you mean
something else?

> It takes 3 steps to get the "model" right, then the controller interprets
> the model (creates the view).  It seems to me that, the way xml/xsl works,
> letting the controller build the view is not much different than having the
> controller grab a pre-built view and supply the model to it.  In the XSP
> layer I do all the stuff that Java is good for (or at least in my app's
> context): grab session and request variables, do authentication, build the
> sql queries and perform updates and inserts.

Sound interesting. BTW - are there any publicly available apps based on
Cocoon (more sophisticated than examples from the distribution) that people
could study and learn from?

> For a while I didn't have what I now call my controller layer in there, and
> putting it in bumped up my average processing times by 100- 150 ms, but
> that's not a big deal for me, and who doesn't mind paying a small performace
> cost for cleaner code (not me!).

Same here. However, these milliseconds here and there add up and start me
wondering what are actual response times I am going to achieve in production
environment. Has anyone tested what load can practically be handled by ~1GHz
Intel boxes? Is SMP helping much? Anyone with experience with deploying
Cocoonish systems on Linux?

Thanks again,
--   |  "Man in the Moon and other weird things" -  |  see it at
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