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From montefin <monte...@finux.com>
Subject Re: Cocoon blues under the Sun
Date Wed, 02 Feb 2000 02:39:19 GMT
Cocoon has won the award! The neatest piece of software with the most self-defeating
documentation.

I have two Cocoons actually handling XML pages here now, on two separate Apache
servers. One is Apache-1.3.4 /JServ-1.0 with Exeter/Cocoon-1.3.1 installed, and the
other is Apache-1.3.9-8 /JServ-1.0b4 with Cocoon-1.6.1 almost installed. Both have
seperate JDK-1.1.7_v3 and JSDK2.0 environments on a Red Hat 6.1, Linux-2.2.14,  i686
box.

I ventured into Cocoon to help me learn XML. I've learned more than I bargained for.

The Exeter/Cocoon here at finux.com was installed, in 1/2 of an afternoon thanks to
Exeter's clear docs and savvy, well thought out architecture. That Cocoon has given
me no problems whatsoever in the 3 months it has been up, running and handling XML
requests. NOT ONE ERROR OR EXCEPTION MESSAGE, here or on remote visitors' screens for
3 months.

The other!? The direct from Cocoon version? Well, I started back in August, 1999 with
Cocoon-1.4 and immediately jumped at Cocoons 1.5 and 1.6 when they were released
hoping each would have better and better README's, INSTALL's and fewer and fewer
bugs.

Sad to say, none of the direct Cocoons has ever gotten fully implemented.

I dedictaed this past weekend to making Cocoon-1.6.1 work. I decided to scrap the
Cocoon team's docs  and try mimicing Exeter's simple and straightforward install
guidelines and logical, organized, sensible file structures and now have got it like
3/4 of the way there.  It's begun to handle locally prepared XML pages and .class
files, but, oddly enough, not anything, not a .class or a .xml, from the Cocoon
team's package. Still, I am committed to making it work. I have an enterprise to
build here and XML is the path I've chosen.

Imagine how I brightened then at the "ingenius, cutting-edge" local XML build
possibilty using ant! I mean, sure it was buried deep inside the bowels of the new,
even-harder-to-navigate Cocoon documentation, but, hey, why not give it a shot? I too
CVS'd "jakarta-tools", downloaded, installed and went down in flames once more!

Then I read the "jakarta-ant" message below! Oh Boy!

Stupid me, I was using "old stuff" that Cocoon had recommended in their NEW DOCS!
Seeing the light at the end of the tunnel, I went straight back to CVS and got the
following just a few minutes ago:

[montefin@finux montefin]$ cvs checkout jakarta-ant
cvs server: cannot find module `jakarta-ant' - ignored
cvs [checkout aborted]: cannot expand modules
[montefin@finux montefin]$ cvs checkout 'jakarta-ant'
cvs server: cannot find module `jakarta-ant' - ignored
cvs [checkout aborted]: cannot expand modules
[montefin@finux montefin]$ cvs checkout "jakarta-ant"
cvs server: cannot find module `jakarta-ant' - ignored
cvs [checkout aborted]: cannot expand modules


I'm sure I'll be told I did something wrong, or went to the wrong archive, or have
the wrong ingredients, or "gee, we fixed that with this and you should have read our
minds," but hey I have had Exeter's Cocoon running WITHOUT ERRORS OR EXCEPTIONS for 3
months on basically the same ingredients.

And no, I do not write messages like this all the time. I have never once posted
anything remotely like this. It's just that I'm feeling the frustration
of...of...like meeting a very attractive woman at the carwash. She wants me. I want
her. We both know it. She gives me her phone number. I rush home to call only to find
she has the worst penmanship on the planet.

I've written software documentation. I know how important it is to be clear, concise,
definite, complete, accurate and simple if you want users to be able to use it.
Please, somebody write some of that for Cocoon!

There. I feel so much better now.

If anyone successfully downloads a copy of this new ant and gets "everything to work
just fine" on a distro of Cocoon-1.6.1. I would really appreciate knowing of it.

Thanks,

montefin

P.S.  Before I click SEND, I'm going back to cvs and back to my inbox just to check
once more. If you are reading this you'll know that nothing has changed.


Stefano Mazzocchi wrote:

>
> Ant is now located on its own CVS module called "jakarta-ant" what's
> found in jakarta-tools is old stuff.
>
> Make sure you get _that_ ant and everything will work just fine.
>
> --
> Stefano Mazzocchi      One must still have chaos in oneself to be
>                           able to give birth to a dancing star.
> <stefano@apache.org>                             Friedrich Nietzsche
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