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From James Chartrand <>
Subject Re: POST XML to cocoon protocol
Date Fri, 28 Jan 2005 00:06:45 GMT

We are also interested in a BPEL like approach to combining web 
services from within Cocoon, although for a different reason than 
yours, and with different requirements.  In our case, the web services 
are text analysis tools, provided as SOAP services by various text 
analysis researchers.  We are using the Cocoon portal engine as a 
central access point to the tools (through SOAP).  The tools are 
written in many different programming languages, with many different 
native interfaces and installation requirements.  The portal therefore 
does away with the need to install, configure, and to some extent, 
understand how to interact with the tools.

The portal also acts as a 'workbench' for working with the tools,  
allowing the end user to combine text analysis tools in novel ways, to 
record the results of their combinations (and thereby effectively 
create a 'new' tool that is the combination of other web services - 
i.e., dynamically generate BPEL), graph results (actually just another 
tool), compare results, and so on.  We therefore need a means to record 
new tool combinations (BPEL), and a corresponding means to invoke the 
tool combinations.

 From your post, your needs appear somewhat different than ours, but I 
mention our project just in case there is some opportunity to work 
together, or in case someone else is doing similar work who would like 
to collaborate.  The project is led by Dr. Geoffrey Rockwell at 
McMaster University in Hamilton, Ontario (Canada) and is called TAPoR 
(Text Analysis Portal fOr Research -   Our company, Open 
Sky Solutions, has been contracted to build the portal, which is 
ultimately to be released as open source.  We also hope to make some 
significant contributions to Cocoon along the way.

James Chartrand
Open Sky Solutions, Unit 2, 17 Paradise Road South, Hamilton, ON, 
Canada, L8S 1S1
905-523-9120    905-523-0768 (fax)

On 27-Jan-05, at 4:17 PM, Irv Salisbury III wrote:

> Daniel Fagerstrom wrote:
>> Irv Salisbury III wrote:
>>> I didn't mean to offend anyone.  I have answered a number of 
>>> questions, and me and my company have given a few things to both 
>>> cocoon and xreporter.  I realize you weren't accusing me, but wanted 
>>> to point that out.  I certainly am not looking for any free hand 
>>> outs.  Cocoon is a very busy list, and trying to monitor both the 
>>> users and dev list is very difficult.  I did for a long time and 
>>> couldn't do both.  As having used cocoon for quite awhile, I really 
>>> do want to help, but I felt I had to pick between helping users or 
>>> helping dev.
>>> Your point is well taken and I will join the dev list so I don't 
>>> have to post in that way again.  On the other hand, the users list 
>>> has become so busy that more "dev" questions like mine go 
>>> unanswered.  (Which is where I started and received no help, forcing 
>>> me to begrudingly ask for the dev help)
>> Excelent that you contribute to the user list, I didn't know as you 
>> didn't tell that you allready had tried in there. Anyway don't worry, 
>> except for me, people are nice and friendly around here ;) 
>> Furthermore as tech junkies we mainly care about if the questions are 
>> interesting, and your was.
>> It seem to me that you good answers later in the thread, so I don't 
>> think I have anything to add to that.
>> /Daniel
> I did get great answers.  One of the "hot" things a lot of our 
> customers are looking at now is orchestrating web services together.  
> Separating major pieces of the app behind REST style web services and 
> then tying that together with things like BPEL.  That is really where 
> my question was driven at.  I guess it would be interesting to see if 
> there was any thought about integrating BPEL into cocoon.  Kind of 
> like a "flowscript" but in XML, but that could call cocoon pipelines, 
> massage their content and string together reusable smaller pipelines.  
> That was where my difficulty lies.  I have a series of small, reusable 
> pipelines, but that take XML in and return XML.  So, I need to 
> "orchestrate that".  A key piece to this would be an architecture that 
> let XML come into each internal cocoon call.
> Anyway,  thanks to all!
> Irv

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