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From "Robert Simmons" <robert.simm...@norcom.de>
Subject Re: Porting Cocoon Logging to Log4j - Proposal and Discussion
Date Thu, 28 Aug 2003 11:07:12 GMT
It is .. Ive been wrong before and I admit Im no Avalon or cocoon source
code expert. Im very direct in my style and I wish people wouldnt take it
offensively. I merely abhor cheerleading. There are lots of things I love
about cocoon but the logging irritates me. *shrug* =^)

"Reinhard Poetz" <reinhard@apache.org> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
news:000101c36d51$375fce30$1e01a8c0@WRPO...
>
> > From: Robert Simmons
> >
> >
> > "Gianugo Rabellino" <gianugo@apache.org> schrieb im
> > Newsbeitrag news:3F4DD22A.6030004@apache.org...
> > > Robert Simmons wrote:
> > > > Actually, I was proposign the removal of the avalon logging
> > > > mechanism completely.
> > >
> > > You'll have to provide a very good technical reason for that, much
> > > more than "I like Log4J better" or "Log4J is cool". Consider that:
> >
> > How about the fact that multiple layers of logging exacerbate
> > performance problems intrinsic to logging. Also how about the
> > fact that Log4j is faster
>
> Have you ever done some serious tests that you can claim this?
>
>
> > and far more powerful and flexible
> > in production environments where you may want logging to go
> > to a specific server. Also how about the fact that most other
> > java products that log use log4j and very very few use avalon
> > logging. This allows a support center to set up a logging
> > monitor stations for system health monitoring.
> >
> > I think about the business applications of cocoon which are
> > far different than the open source programming aspects.
> >
> > > 1. Avalon logkit can use Log4J as the backend enging while, to the
> > > best of my knowledge, the opposite is not true;
> >
> > Then you have a multi-layer logging mechanism which is evil
> > for performance reasons.
> >
> > > 2. logging is tightly integrated inside the Avalon
> > lifecycle, which is
> > > tied to logkit. Changing it to Log4J would be painful to say the
> > > least.
> >
> > This point I cant speak to. Personally I know so few products
> > that use avalon that I wonder why cocoon hasnt gotten away
> > from it but perhaps that isnt possible. *shrug* Avalon is as
> > old as AWT and I think just as outdated.
>
> could you please fill in:
>
>   AWT : Avalon = Swing : ?
>
>
> Sorry, I can't take it very serious if someone says we should remove
> Avalon from Cocoon. This would be the same if I say you should completly
> rewrite a working Swing application in favour of SWT ...
>
> >
> > > But, in case there are very good reasons for it, I guess no Cocoon
> > > developer was ever married to logkit, and a better solution
> > is always
> > > welcome. Let me be skeptical, though. :-)
> >
> > Skeptical is good as long as it doesnt change into stubborness.
>
> You say it - I hope it was meant in both directions.
>
> Cheers,
> Reinhard
>
>




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