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From Daniel Fagerstrom <>
Subject Re: M2 (was RE: defects in M1)
Date Tue, 06 May 2003 22:20:50 GMT
Niclas Hedhman wrote:
> On Saturday 03 May 2003 05:33 am, Stefano Mazzocchi wrote:
>>Know what? sometimes I think we should just call it Cocoon 2.1 final
>>right now and stop caring that much because darwinism will make it go
> But I agree, Cocoon SHOULD be more courageous and make a final release, albeit 
> with known issues. There will always be known issues.

Yes, doing a final release is not the end of the world. AFAIK most of 
Cocoon-2.1 is rock solid and has stable interfaces. At the company I 
work for, we use it for all of our webapps without any problems and I 
guess that the same goes for most people at the dev-list.

What is not stable right now are the flow layer APIs. IMHO that is also 
the way it should be. Even if the use of the flow layer seem to grow 
quite fast now, it still seem to have a fairly small user base. To try 
to force some finalization of the APIs at this stage would be premature 
and would probably mainly be harmful for the development of it. Our 
comunity needs to gather more experience of using the concepts first.

The same goes for my favorite area: input handling, there is still some 
R&D left to be done before we can say that *this* is the Cocoon way of 
handeling input.

Sometimes it seem like we should not do a release until all APIs are 
stable. But if all APIs are stble it would mean that there is nothing 
left to develop or that the developers and users have lost interest for 
Cocoon. In a dynamic world, no change means death.

The situation will of course be much easier when we have implented the 
block mechanism and Cocoon is a micro kernel and we can have separate 
release cycles for the kernel and the blocks.

But we do not need to wait for a technical solution, we can do something 
right now, it is all about how we choose to describe Cocoon. Instead of 
saying that Cocoon-2.1 is not stable yet, we can say that Cocoon 
consists of a lot of different parts (kernel, modules, blocks etc), the 
majority of which are rock solid and used in numerous webapps worldwide. 
  Then we list what is not stable, in what way it lacks stability and 
that if you are going to depend on these parts it is probably a good 
idea to subscribe the dev-list right away ;)

So why not release a Cocoon-2.1 final within a few weeks and say 
something like:

The Apache Cocoon team is proud to announce the new release
of Apache Cocoon
It also contain a preview version of the flow framework, a technology 
that is going to change the way that people think about webapp 
development. If can't wait to lift your webapp development to the next 
level, you must be prepared that some parts of the flow framework still 
are under development, and that some interfaces will change.

/Daniel Fagerstrom

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