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From Berin Loritsch <>
Subject Re: [RT] what cocoon is doing wrong
Date Tue, 25 Feb 2003 19:06:58 GMT
Stefano Mazzocchi wrote:
> There are a few things that we are doing wrong. I'll make a dump of my 
> random thoughts about these in order to foster a discussion.
> Building on sand
> ----------------
> We developped a habit of building on sand.
> Recently on avalon-dev I expressed my concerns about their habit of 
> moving stuff around for elegance-sake, but I'm starting to think that 
> Cocoon is abusing avalon and this places too much pressure on their 
> shoulders.

We appreciate this help.  We are trying to be as concientious as

> Example: the instrumentation. The Cocoon core is based on code that has 
> never been released. So, Avalon has the right to move it around (and 
> screw us). But I don't think it's *their* fault, it's entirely ours.

It is not the Avalon team's intention to "screw" anyone.  We want to
work closely with all our users to provide the best solution.

> I'm starting to think that the Cocoon dev team should create a policy
>   +------------------------------------------------------+
>   | never commit code that depends on non-released stuff |
>   +------------------------------------------------------+

Excellent policy.  Most commercial companies require that.

> Huge library dependance
> -----------------------
> Let's look at the list of libraries we depend on:
> why do we depend on different 'concurrent' libraries?

:)  Actually CVS HEAD only requires Doug Lea's stuff.
We will be releasing ECM again right after Framework which
will finalize the only released libs to only use the one concurrent

> why do we have altRMI stuff over in /lib/optional when they are needed 
> by the instrumentation that is placed on /lib/core? wouldn't it be core 
> itself?

AltRMI is not necessarily *required* for InstrumentManager.  It is only
necessary for connecting to an already running JVM.  The Avalon team is
also looking into this dependency ourselves.  It is somewhat messy to
require AltRMI for instrument (which we are looking to officially
release RSN).

> why we depend on cornerstone-excalibur-thread*?

That's what I asked a while ago.

> Scratchpad considered harmful
> -----------------------------
> I repeat my proposal to kill the scratchpad


> enough for now. i need food.

Low blood sugar is bad ;P

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