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From "Geoff Howard" <>
Subject RE: Cocoon is too complex for consumption?
Date Sat, 25 Jan 2003 14:21:58 GMT
I think a practical and attainable suggestion that could come out of this
would be to provide a minimal binary distribution along with the "everything
but the kitchen sink" model.  The suggestion for new people would be to
download both, play with the kitchen sink, and then start developing their
app on the stripped down version.

Adding in the few things you need that aren't standard (with a full version
to refer to for examples) is probably going to be easier for new users than
digging through to determine what is not needed.  And obviously some people
don't want to have to build from source, which I understand.  I don't build
apache or tomcat from source unless I have to for some reason, and then I
expect some complexity.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jeff Turner []
> Sent: Saturday, January 25, 2003 8:06 AM
> To:
> Subject: Re: Cocoon is too complex for consumption?
> > > So how could cocoon be of use to me and others like me? If I
> could build a
> > > war with simply any special classes I have (generators, etc)
> my XSL pages
> > > and a sitemap. Then I deploy that war and cocoon figures out
> how to wire
> > > things together.
> >


> > In general I agree that Cocoon is too "feature-oriented" and not at all
> > "user-oriented".
> > If you know the product as the back of your hand, yes, you
> think everything is
> > dirt easy, but it is overwhelming to get started. (The good
> news is that it
> > is 10x better now than in the "old days", when you needed ~10
> additional
> > downloads and installations.)
> >
> > In fact, I think Cocoon is so powerful, that it has kind of
> grown out of its
> > "servlet" image. It should traverse to the next level (or two),
> and has its
> > own deployment system. Collect your stuff (sitemap and all)
> into a JAR and
> > "hand it over". It is almost like that already, and should be a
> fairly easy
> > addition to make, but the developer community is much more focused on
> > additional features.

Of course blocks when finished should (and already do if you're willing to
work from source dist) go a long way to helping identify and exclude
unneeded pieces.


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