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Date: Wed,  9 Oct 2002 10:44:47 +0200
From: Stefano Mazzocchi <stefano@apache.org>
To: cocoon-dev@xml.apache.org
Subject: Re: [FYI] Profiling Cocoon...
References: <3DA07323.5090903@apache.org> <3DA0A558.90502@anyware-tech.com>
 <3DA0AAFF.5060701@outerthought.org> <3DA0AFD4.6080501@apache.org>
 <3DA14154.5010306@outerthought.org>
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Quoting Steven Noels <stevenn@outerthought.org>:

> >> I'm not saying we shouldn't be bugtesting for XSLTC, it's just that I 
> >> don't know if the XSLTC community will be there to follow up on our 
> >> bug reports.
> > 
> > 
> > I hear you. Consider it a stress-test of both the software *and* the 
> > community around it.
> 
> I've been investigating 
> http://marc.theaimsgroup.com/?l=xalan-cvs&s=xsltc a bit and it seems 
> like there are some people actively working on it. Only Sun-people 
> however

yes and, admittedly, this sucks from a diversity of community perspective. But 
should I remind you that Xalan suffered more or less the same problem for at 
least 18 months?

>, and I recently organized an XSLT seminar with Michael Kay who 
> was quite 'amused' w.r.t. XSLTC compliance & partial performance 
> optimalization of XSLTC. But he's obviously biased :-)

Can you please elaborate more on this?

> > Anyway, just a reminder: you never get people to scratch if you don't 
> > create some itches :)
> 
> Would that be itches or just pet peeves? ;-)

I think nobody here gives a damn about what XSLT engine they are using as long 
as it's fast and compliant. I'll leave ego fights to those who still enjoy them.
 
> > And if this thing doesn't work out as expected, we can always ship 
> > Cocoon 2.1 final with Xalan enabled.
> > 
> > What do you think?
> 
> Fair enough. We'll be a prime beta test site for both Avalon and XSLTC. 

At one point, Sam Ruby was very puzzled by the ability of the cocoon community 
to work with so many different projects and all of them on the bleeding edge 
and still being able to manage not to piss off users every day.

That lead to the creation of gump which pretty much shows that that earlier 
hidden contracts are made visibile, the solid the whole net of contracts become.

> I believe we should definitely start warning people upfront that they 
> really should stick to release versions, instead of relying on CVS 
> checkouts of HEAD/2.1-dev - for some reason, there's quite some people 
> using CVS instead of our release version. But that's another rant.

I think that a WARNING page is enough for people that want to try things out 
and know where we are heading and planning in advance. And I think they know 
very well the cost of rewriting things when something change under your feet. 
The use of open source software is partially because of that.

-- 
Stefano Mazzocchi                       <stefano@apache.org>
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