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From Geoff Howard <>
Subject RE: [PROPOSAL] "sexy" Cocoon Demo App Idea
Date Fri, 16 Aug 2002 21:11:00 GMT
maybe that'll help.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Geoff Howard 
> Sent: Thursday, August 15, 2002 11:51 PM
> To: ''
> Subject: [PROPOSAL]Cocoon Demo App Idea
> In listening to the various discussions that have been 
> popping up regarding
> the desire to create some live demonstration sites to show cocoon's
> abilities and begin to establish some best practices examples for web
> applications using cocoon, I've been thinking a few things.  
> Bear with me, a
> practical suggestion follows.
> 1) <Not the main point/>Wouldn't a killer app be to 
> demonstrate the use of
> cocoon as a better front end to an EJB based application?  
> What about taking
> an existing EJB app and showing how quickly it can be placed 
> behind cocoon?
> Cocoon gives the code reuse and flexibility on the front end 
> that EJB gives
> on the back end.  Could one use the actual Pet Store demo?
> That led to the practical suggestion, which dovetails with the
> Documentation/Wiki issue, and the problem I see with the 
> unfriendly nature
> of the list for the casual/new user.  ...
> 2) What about taking an existing good forums application and 
> using it as a
> cocoon datasource?  With interoperability with newsgroups and 
> email lists,
> it could tame the current list "problem".  It could be used 
> to add forums
> discussion to the bottom of the docs (not on i 
> understand) ,
> enabling a user to right there for all the world to see say 
> "this makes no
> sense" or "this has changed since this was written" or "your 
> grammer is
> bad".
> My suggestion would be "Jive" 
> - it's not "open source" but source code is provided
> - it's not free, but it is free for this use (if i read correctly)
> - it's good (check out the current customers - jboss and 
> among them.
> - it's more of an established concept than Wiki (no offense - 
> not trying to
> shut that down)
> - the "skins" system is not xml/xsl and they are not sold on 
> xsl because
> "it's too hard to learn, and it's slow".  Their suggestion 
> for a better
> system is (get this) the world wide industry standard: Tea.
> - although i haven't looked at the code yet, they do have xml 
> export/import
> ability (option one), and it's JSP based (option two - create an "xml"
> skin), and it's "bean" based (option 3 - marshall the beans 
> in the generator
> - i think we need better built in functionality for this any way)
> - some other good things that I can't remember right now 
> because it's almost
> midnight my time.
> I can't offer to head this up because my company's being 
> bought out and i'm
> in need of a job in the next few weeks, but I can offer to 
> help (unless my
> next employer discourages open source contributions).
> I have no connection with Jive software, nor do I know anyone 
> who does by
> the way.
> Ain't just jive talkin', 
> Geoff Howard
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