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From TREGAN Fabien <>
Subject RE: We need a detailed comparison with Struts
Date Wed, 12 Jun 2002 06:54:01 GMT
>> Right, but this 3rd party stuff (in lib/optional) is for features that
Struts doesn't provide.
>yes, but this feeds into the marketing problem.  Just what IS Cocoon?

  This is important : one of the main problem I hade when I said that wanted
to use C2 for my project is that Cocoon defines itself as a "publication
framework". The answer I hade was "we are not making a news portal, but a
real application, we do not need to publish the content of our database in
html, but to provide services with a web client".
  So, when I hade to compare Cocoon with Struts (yes, I'm one of the 3
Sylvain spoke about :), I tryed not to present Cocoon as a "publication
framework" but as :
-a MVC framework with text configured, extensible, controler
-a framework that do not provide anything for the business tier (model) and
oblige you to separate have a separated business tier (EJB, custom API) wich
can provide XML
-a pipe system based on XML and "transformers" for the view.
-Avalon is great

So now how does it compare to Struts ?
-Struts is a MVC Framework
-Struts don't oblige you bother with XML, but don't get real advantage of it
-Struts leave it up to you to separate business and application tier, and
JSP don't help you to separate logic and presentation.
-If you can afford it, an application server is great

So :
-Struts is faster to learn
-(Struts should be faster to run, and use less memory, but we should test
that, and use an EJB server or use Avalon in struts)
-With struts, you can reuse all your javabean instead of loosing time to
XMLize them
-If you do not think XML is a must, if you do not want to separate logique
from presentation, business from application, ok, use struts. I'll have warn

(maybe a more formal report when I have time to write it, but the important
idea there is : Is Cocoon just a publication framework, or is it a Web
Applicatioin Framework ?)

>What does seperation of concerns (thanks for not abbreviating it) mean 
>to my boss?  (Yes I know what it means, but
>its not a good high-level perspective.  MVC has caught on.  
>Many of the 
>paycheck signers don't know what it means but
>they now know its something they should have...) -- and by the 
>way...sometimes I sell struts because its better than the
>approach they have and Cocoon is way over their head or seems more 
>risky.  I'd still categorize cocoon as an emerging
>technology.  Struts has nearly achieved "standard" level.

Is there a "Software Engeneering for Dummys" book, I need one ? (for a


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