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From Berin Loritsch <>
Subject Re: ESQL no longer applied to custom logicsheet
Date Fri, 28 Dec 2001 17:02:56 GMT
Davanum Srinivas wrote:

> Berin,
> Sorry for the delay in answering...There are two Use-Case Scenarios.
> UseCase #1: A Developer who is writing a new LogicSheet
> UseCase #2: A Consumer who is using one or more LogicSheets in his XSP.
> I'd consider XSP System broken IF-AND-ONLY-IF UseCase #2 has problems because of the
order of
> LogicSheets in his XSP. Is this the case?

It's hard to tell.  Around Cocoon Beta 1 everything was working perfectly.  Now, all of the
sudden, things aren't working anymore.  The ONLY thing to have changed is Cocoon itself.

I disagree, no developer (logicsheet writer or consumer) should have to worry about how they
order their namespace declarations.  I even tried moving the declarations in the logicsheet
to no avail.

The Contracts in XML are that namespaces do not matter about the ordering.  If it is declared
it is used.  We should keep that perception consistent -- ESPECIALLY since we cannot control
the order of attributes the parser gives us, or the order of namespace start messages the
parser gives us.  If the parser implementation changes the order, then your pages will be
broken--and you will be left wondering why.

The bottom line is that you CANNOT rely on the order of the attributes.  According to the
and SAX specs, it is valid to give the attributes and namespaces in any order--as long as
are declared prior to the element that declares them and attributes are passed with the start

> Thanks,
> dims
> --- Berin Loritsch <> wrote:
>>Ugo Cei wrote:
>>>Berin Loritsch wrote:
>>>>We once had everything working where ESQL would work even if it was 
>>>>called by a
>>>>custom logicsheet.  I have a previously tested Logicsheet, and Cocoon 
>>>>is not applying
>>>>ESQL--it was working before.  I cannot post the logicsheet to the list 
>>>>stuff in there).
>>>>Here is the beginning of it:
>>>><xsl:stylesheet version="1.0"
>>>>                xmlns:xsl=""
>>>>                xmlns:xsp=""
>>>>                xmlns:esql=""
>>>>                xmlns:xspdoc=""
>>>I had the same problem some time ago, I think it was in the passage from 
>>>a beta of C2 to rc1. I think I solved it by changing the order of 
>>>namespace declarations, i.e. putting xmlns:esql AFTER the declaration of 
>>>my custom logicsheet's namespace.
>>So that is the time it was broken!
>>Dims had fixed the XSP system so that you only had to declare namespaces that
>>you actually used.  The algorithm was supposed to reorder the templates so
>>that it always produced valid results.  I will try the reordering of the
>>namespace declarations in the logicsheet.
>>I CONCIDER THE XSP SYSTEM BROKEN!  Any time the algorithm to apply logicsheets
>>imposes a restriction to the order the *developer* has to follow, when the
>>underlying markup does not impose the same restriction, you are violating the
>>simple XML contracts!
>>"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety
>>  deserve neither liberty nor safety."
>>                 - Benjamin Franklin
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> =====
> Davanum Srinivas -
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