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From "Colin Britton" <cbrit...@centervilletech.com>
Subject RE: cvs commit: xml-cocoon/webapp/docs/samples/xsp cookie.xsp
Date Wed, 18 Apr 2001 14:29:57 GMT
> > I think that removing this without showing how people are 
> meant to work
> > is like chopping off someones legs. 
> Hm, nice comparison...

I like it ;-)

> The sitemap is the only place for the workflow of your 
> application, thus
> redirects belong to the sitemap and not to the XML (XSP) 
> level. That is
> only content - and a redirect is not content at all. So we 
> have here again
> SoC: sitemap for workflow and the pipeline-processing for content.

Oh don't get me wrong, I am all for it but we need to make it crystal
clear to new C2 users how this stuff is meant to go together or else we
will be answering a million emails on how to do old habits in this new
technology.

> > A good scenario to make clear the usage for xsp would be for a user
> > login, lets say we have a form which checks a user name and 
> password in
> > a database, this form is processed by an xsp (I know you 
> could do it in
> > actions but a lot of people do this in XSP with C1). The 
> result is is
> > the person is allowed in they get redirected to welcome.xsp 
> or if false
> > get redirected to login_failed.xsp. You may have a better example in
> > which case great.
> > 
> No this example is absolutely perfect - we do exactly this many times,
> and guess how: with Actions. XSP was the solution for C1 as 
> there weren't
> any actions, now we have the better (?) solution: Actions.
> So what you would do, is instead of creating an XSP page 
> which does the
> evaluation of the form, you would simply write an action which does
> the same, and then you could use the following sitemap fragment:
> 
> <map:match pattern="test-page">
> <map:act type="UserValidationAction"> <!-- returns a map if 
> the user is allowed -->
>   <map:redirect-to uri="welcome.xsp"/>
> </map:act>
> <map:redirect-to uri="login_failed.xsp"/>
> </map:match>

OK so my example was best dealt with using an action - is there a
UserValidationAction (not today) to show people...... how does the map
object get passed back.... etc.... I know this may be obvious to people
familliar with C2 but to newbies this stuff is going to fill our email
box. 

We need to make this VERY clear. For a user writing
<xsp-response:send-redirect location="http://foo.com"/> is simple,
taking something that simple away and not having an equivelent method is
a problem in my book.

So as another example what if we want to redirect to a value that is
returned from a database call... where the user wants to use esql
(beacuse it is *simple*) to retirve the value from the database? how is
that redirect passed back to the sitemap?

I hope this thread is helping people think about the users, not
developers, because at the end of the day we want more users than
developers using this solution.

rgds
CB

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