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From Stefano Mazzocchi <>
Subject Re: [cocoon 2] removing bottenecks
Date Mon, 22 May 2000 22:00:37 GMT
Giacomo Pati wrote:
> Hi all,
> Stefano Mazzocchi wrote:
> >
> > Due to problems with Pierpaolo that clearly is not able to do the job he
> > volunteered for,  I'm right now proposing the election of a new Cocoon2
> > project coordinator.
> Could we know what the problem is? Lack of time?

that's the main problem, I have no idea! and Pier doesn't reply at all.

> >
> > Even if I don't have much time, I volunteer for that role, trying to
> > coordinate effort and provide substantial background for this project to
> > _happen_.
> Tell us what a project coordinator should be able to do (except coding).

Coding is not directly part of its job. In fact, if I become project
coordinator, I won't do much coding after all due to lack of time.
> I do project coordination in my day job (for commercial project). I can
> only imagine what the diffrence is between open source projects and
> commercial projects (I've never lead a open source project). 

I never did project coordinatrio for commercial projects, so I can't
tell you either :)

> The main
> diffrence I think is the commitment to the project and the
> responsability of such a commitment. As project leader/coordinator you
> can't say "he, get your job done, or you'll be fired" instead the
> commiters should say "he, I ran out of free time for the project, can
> anybody help me getting stuff done?". 


I would like to clarify: I'm not disappointed because Pier couldn't find
time to dedicate to this project. Hell, no. This is a volunteer effort
and we are all friends and we all understand everybody needs a day job
to make a living.

I'm disappointed by lack of communication and the stall that this
created in the project.

> So, more status reports from the
> commiter telling what is going on with parts of the project they
> commited to would help to give other commiters a view how the project is
> forthcomming (as it happened to me not knowing who does what and when,
> so wait until new drops into the mailing list).

Project coordinator should be responsible for:

1) do the actual submission checkins when nobody else does it
2) clean up, update and regenerate the web site
3) create the distributions
4) settle technical and human conflicts (if they happen)

But the most important responsibility is: 

5) being there!

A project needs a catalizer in order to work, catalizers are
coordinators, people that don't tell you what to do, but suggest you the
best way of doing things, to avoid code replication, to avoid stalls and
problems down the road.

Is the one that has the global vision and tries to help everybody else
with his job.

Sometimes its very boring and frustrated, sometimes is deeply rewarding.

I don't believe I'm the best coder around here (no, by far!), but I
acted as a catalizer for this community and this worked very well (for
what I can tell).

Sure, I'm not perfect and I did many mistakes, but I always tried to be

This is what you should do to be the man for the job.
> > This would automatically close down the Cocoon 1.x branch, which will
> > remain there just and only for bugfixes, but nothing else will added to
> > that branch or backported from Cocoon2.
> >
> > I must say I'm very disappointed by everything that happened on the
> > Cocoon2 branch so far, on the management side of things. (I don't have
> > to say anything about code, Pier, Donald and Ricardo did a great job
> > indeed).
> Maybe we all have waited to long not talking about responabilities.

You know, I didn't want to give Pier a hard time. He is probably already
frustrated by his day job and I know he's moving apartment right now so
I wanted to give him time to settle and come back.

But this project can't afford to wait any longer.
> > But the project lacks coordination and I see forking frictions
> > developping in the community, along with higher expectance.
> >
> > The plan is going to change:
> >
> >  - alpha version for Javaone
> >  - beta version for ApacheCON 2000 Europe
> >  - final version for XMas
> >
> > and I hope you all come and give us hands.
> >
> > Please, place your vote and comments.
> >
> > and let's get things done, damn it, instead of waiting on out butts
> > forever.
> As I've writte above: what is the status of the project. Since weeks no
> checkins have been made to the cvs.

The status of the project is the same of the initial checkins with some

1) Ricardo has a working XSP implementation
2) Donald has a working XInclude filter (checked in)
3) Paul has written patches for static content generation (a-la
4) I have more ideas on how the sitemap, xlink and RDF could be
5) some Tomcat installation docs have been written (but not checked in)
6) some bugs have been fixed (but not checked in)

Disclaimer: I didn't touch a single line of Cocoon2 yet.

we need to remove the dust, include those things, write some startup
docs and make an alpha distribution ASAP.

Giacomo, if you volunteer for the job, I'm more than happy to vote for

... but, please, if you think you can't do it, or others don't like his
operate, let's not wait another two months to tell, ok?

Stefano Mazzocchi      One must still have chaos in oneself to be
                          able to give birth to a dancing star.
<>                             Friedrich Nietzsche
 Missed us in Orlando? Make it up with ApacheCON Europe in London!
------------------------- http://ApacheCon.Com ---------------------

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