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From Stefano Mazzocchi <>
Subject Re: [RT] Variations on themes from Cocoon2, XLink and RDF
Date Fri, 19 May 2000 23:35:19 GMT
Philippe Lavoie wrote:
> One thing is certain, you are spending a lot of tought on this :)

Probably too much :)
> Some comments about your article.
> - Are you hinting at an infrastructure where I could easilly have a human
> readable xml file on my disk, however it would serve a XML file that is
> computer friendly through a sitemap xsl ?

Sort of, yes. This is the direction.
> For example, I have something like
> <document>
>   <section title="Big title">
>         <p>Something of interest to <footnote note="a nice
> comment">people</footnote> reading this.</p>
>       <p>Another nice paragraph about <glossary>GNU</glossary>.
>   </section>
> </document>
> In a sitemap or whaterver xml file I define information that are suitable
> for the site (author, date, etc) and the links between xml files (where is
> the glossary for example)
> Then cocoon will give a XML+RDF+...  to an XML aware browser (or search
> engine) Is that what you are saying ?

Well, RDF was invented to "talk about something". This means that you
need two files: one that contains the data and one that contains the
metadata. In my example I showed RDF contained _inside_ the documenta
and this might not be that good.

I honestly don't know how to move forward... there are so many
possibilities and so much fog ahead.... it's not easy to see the wholes
in the picture.
> - (Related to the above) What I love about Cocoon, is my ability to serve
> HTML files. We found that the big gains comes more in maintainability. To
> that end, the xml files have to be dead simple (very human readable and
> editable). Would all that RDF stuff make it harder for people to generate
> xml files ? 

I really hope not. Otherwise, nobody is going to use it.

> Or would Cocoon handle that complexity (as I mention above) or
> with another schema ?

I would implement all possible machinery to simplify making your XML
more semantic, but metadata is something that you must do, just like XML

My point is to provide an infrastructure that gives you so much power
that the cost of doing RDF is smaller than the gain. Just like XSLT.
> - Your article seems to hint at spending a lot of energy to make web crawler
> return more relevant hits for when they start crawling xml files. Does that
> mean that other concerns are done and over with ?   (yeah, I can't keep up
> with all the e-mails on this list, so I might have missed some of the
> progress made ;)

Sorry, I don't get this.
> Anyway, the future looks bright :)

> Of course, it will be brighter for me when I find a way to do RAD in Java +
> Cocoon. I'm sure it's just that I need to start using this EJB stuff...
> right ?

Hmmm, no.

Many people believe that EJB is just a huge marketing hype. I'm neutral
on that front, not knowing EJB that much.

RAD on the web is dangerous: sometimes you have to spend time on things.
But I see your points and I'm trying to make this project powerful but
also future-compatible with all the authoring efforts that will be
created as soon as XML receives the spread it deserves.

I'm downloading right now XMLSpy 3.0 which looks very nice.

Stefano Mazzocchi      One must still have chaos in oneself to be
                          able to give birth to a dancing star.
<>                             Friedrich Nietzsche
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