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From "Kevin A. Burton" <>
Subject Re: [wanna laught?] Microsoft invented XML
Date Mon, 15 May 2000 06:05:07 GMT
Niclas Hedhman wrote:
> "Kevin A. Burton" wrote:
> >
> > Message to SUN:  "Please Open Source Java!"
> -1 on that

I don't even know where to begin here.  It could be a long thread! :)
> Sun has the desire and $$$ to protect Java in the court rooms when
> attempts are made to crush its promise. 

The point here is that no other company in the world, including
Microsoft, has done more to *crush* Java than SUN.  There were some very
smart people initially involved with Java.  Then the laywers and
marketing guys got involved and screwed things up.

The point is that with the lawsuit against MS SUN has basically said
that they don't want anyone to innovate in the Java space.  This has not
been a good thing for Java.

The point is that if SUN were to pick a good license, maybe require the
code to be republished, then MS would have had to release the code and
then their embrace and extend philosophy wouldn't have worked.

> Which OpenSource project has
> ever gone to court over licenses, how about Sun, and how many times has
> MS (and others) ignored licenses, to crush opponents?

Open Source wouldn't change this fact. If SUN has an Open Source JVM and
someone broke the license they would have the right and will to sue.

> Those questions should be asked before requesting Java to become
> OpenSource. After all, Open Source is a method to improve code, and you
> are free to do so, and your work could be for the gain of all others.

If you don't believe in Java and Open Source, why are you here?  Yes. 
Open Source doesn't win by creating specifications, we win by making
implementations.  The JCP 2.0 goes a logn way to making an Open
Specification process.  No SUN just needs to OSS Java with a decent
license and we will have the best of both worlds.


Kevin A Burton (
Message to SUN:  "Please Open Source Java!"
The house of the unbelievers shall be razed and they shall be
scorched to the earth. Their code will be open until the end of days.

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