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From Andy Lewis <>
Subject RE: Variations on a theme by Cocoon
Date Tue, 15 Feb 2000 14:24:09 GMT
I have Cocoon 1.5 running on an internal server - NT 4, Netscape 3.63, JRun
2.3.3, Sun JDK 1.2.2, COMPAQ Proliant 1600  Dual Pentium II 300, 512M RAM,
and about 37G of RAID 5 disk on a caching SMART Array controller. The web
site is about 2000 pages. With only a dozen people browsing it regularly, we
get out of memory errors, and dismal performance. We also have a somewhat
complex XSLT transformation going on - about 500 lines of templates totaling
about 30k with lots of conditionals....

That's as close to a large production site as I get with it. We actually
produce static HTML files to dump onto the production web servers.

I have another smaller site on a Celeron 333 running Linux, IBM JDK 1.1.8,
with a Sybase backend however. It is a much smaller site, with a much
simpler stylesheet, but far more dynamic, and it runs great.

Andy Lewis
VERITAS Software, Heathrow, Florida
Voice:  407-531-7584  -  Fax:  407-531-7686  -  Cell:  407-718-4718
Pager:  -  EMail:

" Some days, it is best to keep reality at arms length..."

		-----Original Message-----
		From:	Mike Engelhart []
		Sent:	Tuesday, February 15, 2000 9:15 AM
		Subject:	Re: Variations on a theme by Cocoon

		Donald Ball wrote:

		> +1. Personally, I think cocoon should focus more on
functionality and code
		> maintainability than performance. More often than not, the
primary cost
		> contraint for a project is personnel cost - programming
and administration
		> - not hardware. This isn't always the case, but I tend to
think it is for
		> the sorts of sites for which XML and XSLT are a good
		I'm not 100% sure that your cost analysis is true (but i'm
not an analyst
		either ;-)).  First of all, in reality, *all* sites (other
than simple home
		pages) are a good match for XML/XSLT.  Second, if you need
to have 25
		machines to do the work that one or two SMP machines *could*
do if their web
		software was tuned correctly then your theory fails.  I have
no idea what
		Cocoon's performance is (and it's pretty clear that nobody
else does either
		because no one has come out and said they have implemented
Cocoon on a large
		production site) so it's hard to say.  As a side note, it
really would be
		nice to have more than just a JMeter hit on a Cocoon
application to
		determine it's performance level and whether tuning this is
an urgent need
		or not.  JMeter pretty much sucks for determining anything
when you're
		dealing with complex dynamic sites.

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