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From Stefano Mazzocchi <>
Subject Re: Cocoon 2.0 Salutation!!!
Date Mon, 14 Feb 2000 13:06:16 GMT
Pierpaolo Fumagalli wrote:
> Niclas Hedhman wrote:
> >
> > Just downloaded the Cocoon 2.0-alpha...
> :) Next time, just remember how to get a CVS module "branch" :) :)
> > Have not run it yet, but I have gone through the code, and, boy,
> > AM I PLEASED!!!!
> You should run it, and all your "PLEASENESS" will fly away :)

Well, to be _brutally_ honest (as always), I think that Pier's branch is
an alpha0 and it fully deserves it. I mean, there are some interfaces
that, man, made me jump off the chair and scream and yell and ...

anyway... I'm pleased that Niclas is pleased and even if I think that
_most_ of the interfaces that Pier designed must be changed or improved,
I do believe that we have a _clear_ and _global_ vision of how an XML
framework on the server side should look like.

Add SAX2, the proposed API for XML Transformations, XSP and XSLT
extentions, sitemap capabilities, avalon-like modularity, a powerful
build system, some authoring tools... and man, next year, cocoon will be
so far ahead of its times that it will be hard for us to continue

> > Stefano, you won't hear much more wining from me about the architecture
> > from Cocoon 2.0 and on.
> >
> > Today, I am happy I didn't unsubscribed, when I felt Cocoon was too
> > Servlet centric. My prayers has been heard, not by the almighty, but by
> > a code producing italian. Who would guess?
> When that thing popped out, we were already aware of the problem of
> Cocoon's "servlet orientation". That's one of the issues I faced when I
> wrote StyleBook, instead of patching Cocoon 1.x for offline document
> generation...

Yes, Niclas, your prayers were heard, but we were _already_ aware of
those problems... it seemed to me that you were simply blindly not
paying attentions to our discussions.
> > Nice interfaces (particularly the granularity) and easy accessable API,
> > maybe not simple but powerful... I would say that Pier has layered one
> > more abstraction than I would, and I am sure it will benefit us
> > somewhere in the future.
> I didn't layered it out... Hey, I just CODED it... The code is not my
> (C) not my idea... 

And I can tell.... look at AbstractComponent



> It's the result of 1 year of lurking silently on this
> mailing list. Everyone contributed to the design of cocoon, everyone who
> posted something here...
> > Good Work!!!
> Thanks... But as I said, it's the result of 1 year of good team work,
> between me, Stefano, Federico, and all of you on this list...

Yes. The Cocoon2 design started in May last year when we firstly
discussed the use of Cocoon on big environments at the
Exoffice-sponsored exolab. Almost all the people that got into that
adventure and were subscribed to this list were hired by Exoffice
(Arkin, Keith, Pier, Ricardo, Federico) ... Clark and I are the only one
that resisted the attack :)

Anyway, this is to show that we already knew the problems but we didn't
want to do another "patch and go".. doing a revolution in a open source
project is a _very_ dangerous approach. You must understand where to go
way before doing or the project will be forked.

> > Now I am late for Valentine's Day engagements, but I will set my teeth
> > into this tomorrow...
> That's why I am writing the 2.0 :) I don't have to care about Feb the
> 14th and all that crap (I wish I could, but I can't!)

Luckily, both my girlfriend and I hate Valentine's Day :)
> > Viva Pier!!


No, seriously, Pier sucks in creating interfaces and architectures, but
he's an _awesome_ coder. that's why we work together so well, we are
complementary (I hate writing code!)

Stefano Mazzocchi      One must still have chaos in oneself to be
                          able to give birth to a dancing star.
<>                             Friedrich Nietzsche
 Come to the first official Apache Software Foundation Conference!  
------------------------- http://ApacheCon.Com ---------------------

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