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From Andrei Mikhailovsky <and...@arhont.com>
Subject Re: Xenserver and CEPH ?
Date Tue, 25 Nov 2014 12:31:43 GMT
----- Original Message -----

> From: "Nux!" <nux@li.nux.ro>
> To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
> Sent: Tuesday, 25 November, 2014 1:05:39 AM
> Subject: Re: Xenserver and CEPH ?

> Slightly pissed at the "switched to Openstack" remark.
> Using Openstack as a means to "force/suggest" new features into ACS
> is silly. I also want KVM snapshotting to happen, but I think there
> are more important things to fix first.

> In my personal view, I wish ACS stopped completely development on new
> features for a while and made the current features rock solid.

I agree with you on that. There are broken features which are a must to majority of people
and these should be fixed asap instead of introducing new things for a buggy feature set race.


> I know we need new features to keep developers happy who would
> otherwise slit their veins from boredom, but I personally do not
> care that much for S3 compatibility or SDN or what not. When my
> deployment will be large enough to need that I'll probably have
> enough money to develop them myself (and contribute them back).

+1 

> Most people do not need FreeIPA or who knows what other bells and
> whistles.
> I do like Openstack, I know & like some people involved with it and I
> use(d) it (was even a mod on the RDO forum), but I don't want the
> bloody kitchen sink in my servers. I want peace of mind and reliable
> services for my customers who also don't give a rat's arse about
> said features; all they want is their application or site to work
> 24/7.

> Personally I want everything that we have NOW fixed, polished; usage
> stats working (with SG zones), proper backup and restore of volumes,
> security groups finalised (hello IPv6, it's almost 2015!), no silly
> GUI mistakes or typos in new releases and so on.

> Competing with Openstack head on is a dead end, stop chasing!
> Everybody pushes all sorts of stuff into it which takes a lot of
> time, effort and money to get working, if at all.
> Average Joe will not use that in production, just like he won't use
> Gentoo, Fedora or Archlinux in production, it sucks; you use battle
> tested stuff like CentOS or Ubuntu LTS.

> For Average "IT manager" Joe to be capable of using Openstack in
> production companies like Mirantis or eNovance need to take their
> time, freeze it, slow it the fsck down, polish it, decide which
> features can't be used actually (many, I bet!), package it in a sexy
> wrapping and then put it up for sale (or download).

> Basically they'll have to build a Cloudstack. We're already there!
> Sort of ... :-)

> /rant

> --
> Sent from the Delta quadrant using Borg technology!

> Nux!
> www.nux.ro

> ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Outback Dingo" <outbackdingo@gmail.com>
> > To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
> > Sent: Monday, 24 November, 2014 22:15:40
> > Subject: Re: Xenserver and CEPH ?

> > On Tue, Nov 25, 2014 at 8:42 AM, Sebastien Goasguen
> > <runseb@gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> On Nov 24, 2014, at 4:03 PM, Andrei Mikhailovsky
> >> <andrei@arhont.com>
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >> > Yes, agree! Proper snapshotting is a must and an essential part
> >> > of the
> >> cloud in my world. Having this feature broken in KVM for many
> >> years is a
> >> big blow to CloudStack in my opinion.
> >> >
> >> > I am already seeing on blogs and mailing lists people switching
> >> > to
> >> OpenStack because of this problem.
> >>
> >
> > there are many aspects of which cloustack is loosing ground fast to
> > openstack. Even Ive moved away from CS due to deficiencies such as
> > the NFS
> > as secondary being required, vague support for open source SDN such
> > as
> > opendaylight, is another
> > while CS is nice and quite easy to install, and get working, and
> > being a
> > big XEN fan, CS made it clean and simply to deploy, however, it
> > does lack
> > some of the higher end features and configuration aspects that are
> > found in
> > openstack. Now while I
> > also find openstack to be very KVM aligned, as it requires a client
> > be
> > installed on XEN, where CS doesnt, Openstack has moved well ahead
> > in
> > storage and networking options, not boxing me in to high cost
> > commercial
> > solutions. I will credit CS people
> > for great support in the past years over IRC, though lately even
> > that seems
> > waning, as as such there also seems to be more "commercial" support
> > for
> > openstack with the likes of mirantis, ibm, hp and others pushing
> > turn key
> > distros, open source some at that.
> > I did love the simplicity of CS and XEN as a configuration, but
> > felt the
> > lacking in areas of "integration" with other technologies. Even
> > openstack
> > is working to integrate the freeIpa system, and opendaylight into
> > the
> > options, and it works well with ceph, gluster,
> > and other storage systems. CS is simple, and in being that, they
> > are
> > loosing ground fast to the expansive capabilities openstack is
> > offering
> > with their latest release. I wish CS would expand their horizons a
> > bit, and
> > not appear so short sighted and narrow minded
> > when it came to its offerings and integration. I know if I was
> > running the
> > product line currently I would be aligning CS with all the
> > technologies
> > becoming available, especially Software defined networking, and
> > software
> > defined storage. CS is great, but requires
> > a larger feature set, more integration and further vision on
> > trending
> > technologies, yet it is just damn simple to install CS and
> > XEN...... a big
> > win there for CS, though Fuel and Helion appear to be quickly
> > closing that
> > gap.
> >
> >
> >
> >>
> >> Can you send links, I am curious !
> >>
> >> thxs
> >>
> >> > I hate to see people leaving CloudStack as I think it's
> >> > fantastic
> >> project and a really great community!
> >> >
> >> > Andrei
> >> >
> >> > ----- Original Message -----
> >> >
> >> >> From: "Andrija Panic" <andrija.panic@gmail.com>
> >> >> To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
> >> >> Sent: Monday, 24 November, 2014 8:33:56 PM
> >> >> Subject: Re: Xenserver and CEPH ?
> >> >
> >> >> So no CEPH support fot Xen, and no VM snapshot for KVM.
> >> >
> >> >> So, should I shoot my self with gun or with the pistol, that is
> >> >> the
> >> >> question now :)
> >> >
> >> >> thx folks
> >> >
> >> >> On 24 November 2014 at 18:01, Adrian Lewis
> >> >> <adrian@alsiconsulting.co.uk>
> >> >> wrote:
> >> >
> >> >>> From what I've read there won’t be support for Ceph in
> >> >>> Creedence
> >> >>> (Xenserver
> >> >>> 6.5) but it is on the cards for the following release (as
> >> >>> should
> >> >>> NFSv4 and
> >> >>> a
> >> >>> Centos 7 dom0). There's a blog post from Tim Mackey at:
> >> >>>
> >> >>>
> >> http://xenserver.org/discuss-virtualization/virtualization-blog/entry/beyond-creedence-xenserver-2015-planning.html
> >> >>>
> >> >>> and a Youtube video with a few updates here:
> >> >>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3JFUkEfpXaQ
> >> >>>
> >> >>> All looks promising but I'm impatient :-(
> >> >>>
> >> >>> -----Original Message-----
> >> >>> From: Andrija Panic [mailto:andrija.panic@gmail.com]
> >> >>> Sent: 24 November 2014 15:08
> >> >>> To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
> >> >>> Subject: Re: Xenserver and CEPH ?
> >> >>>
> >> >>> THx Vadim - yes, I'm already using KVM with ceph for some time
> >> >>> -
> >> >>> works fine
> >> >>> more or less :) thx
> >> >>>
> >> >>> On 24 November 2014 at 15:52, Vadim Kimlaychuk
> >> >>> <Vadim.Kimlaychuk@elion.ee>
> >> >>> wrote:
> >> >>>
> >> >>>> XenServer 6.5 (or 7.0) is not released yet. You can download
> >> >>>> alpha of
> >> >>>> next release and try it, but it is definately not for
> >> >>>> production.
> >> >>>> I
> >> >>>> haven't personally tried it because Cloudstack does not
> >> >>>> support
> >> >>>> RBD
> >> >>>> storage type for XenServer yet. So you are absolutely right
> >> >>>> --
> >> >>>> first
> >> >>>> we need to wait for XenServer to release then we need to wait
> >> >>>> for
> >> >>>> Cloudstack to implement those changes at backend.
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>> I have used Ceph with KVM hypervisor for a short while. There
> >> >>>> were
> >> >>>> some points that I was not aware, but in general it worked
> >> >>>> well.
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>> Vadim.
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>> -----Original Message-----
> >> >>>> From: Andrija Panic [mailto:andrija.panic@gmail.com]
> >> >>>> Sent: Monday, November 24, 2014 4:22 PM
> >> >>>> To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
> >> >>>> Subject: Re: Xenserver and CEPH ?
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>> HI Vadim, thanks for info. That is what I understood = but
> >> >>>> the
> >> >>>> new
> >> >>>> XenServer 6.5 or whatever the name, shoudl be using kernel
> >> >>>> 3.10.x
> >> >>>> for
> >> >>>> dom0, so I guess even after that is supported, we will need
> >> >>>> to
> >> >>>> wait
> >> >>>> some time for the CloudStack implementation on this ?
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>> Thanks anyway
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>> On 24 November 2014 at 15:00, Vadim Kimlaychuk
> >> >>>> <Vadim.Kimlaychuk@elion.ee>
> >> >>>> wrote:
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>> Hi Andrija,
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>> For XenServer 6.2 it is not possible yet. Look for supported
> >> >>>>> SR-s
> >> >>>>> here:
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>
> >> http://docs.vmd.citrix.com/XenServer/6.2.0/1.0/en_gb/reference.html#ck
> >> >>>> _reference_storage_repository_types
> >> >>>>> Somewhere in internet I saw information that RBD support
is
> >> >>>>> scheduled for the next major XenServer release. Can't find
> >> >>>>> the
> >> >>>>> link
> >> >>>>> right away.
> >> >>>>> The problem connected to Ceph + RBD as primary storage
for
> >> >>>>> XenServer is old dom0 kernel that does not allow RBD storage
> >> >>>>> type.
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>> Regards,
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>> Vadim.
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>> -----Original Message-----
> >> >>>>> From: Andrija Panic [mailto:andrija.panic@gmail.com]
> >> >>>>> Sent: Monday, November 24, 2014 2:06 PM
> >> >>>>> To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
> >> >>>>> Subject: Xenserver and CEPH ?
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>> Hi guys,
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>> anyone running ZenServer with CEPH as primary storage ?
> >> >>>>> I read some info that there is support for CEPH inside
> >> >>>>> XenServer
> >> >>>>> from last year - but since I never actually tried this
-
> >> >>>>> thus
> >> >>>>> the
> >> >>>>> question.
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>> Thanks,
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>> --
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>> Andrija Panić
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>> --
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>> Andrija Panić
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>
> >> >>>
> >> >>>
> >> >>> --
> >> >>>
> >> >>> Andrija Panić
> >> >>>
> >> >
> >> >> --
> >> >
> >> >> Andrija Panić
> >>

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