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From ilya musayev <>
Subject Re: CloudStack Conferences
Date Fri, 06 Mar 2015 23:16:08 GMT
On 3/6/15 8:16 AM, Sebastien Goasguen wrote:
> On Mar 6, 2015, at 11:01 AM, Adrian Lewis <> wrote:
>> My opinion (not sure how much it counts but anyway)
> It counts as much as anyone else Adrian,
The only opinion that does not count is one that was kept silent!
>> is that there are a
>> number of problems here that could be solved with relative ease. Looking
>> in particular at Dublin/Budapest, I'd say that these are very good
>> candidates for merging. The issues I see with having these as separate
>> events are:
> So cutting to the chase, after having had several discussions wit folks on and off the
list, I am talking directly with Linux Foundation to see
> if we can cancel the Budapest event and focus on the Dublin event. The two were 7 days
apart and honestly probably impractical to do.
> We could indeed, either add a day in Dublin as part of the regular event or talk to someone
like Paddy Power to have a second day off-site.
> So your comments are spot on, and it looks like we are in agreement.
> Let me get back to you when I cleared things up with LF and that we can start on planning.
We will need volunteers.
> -sebastien
>> 1. Being a relatively small community still, we should aim to get together
>> physically as much as possible. Mailing lists are great but it's getting
>> people together that seems to make stuff happen. Communities don't work
>> well if they're split up. Clearly, a single global conference causes other
>> issues but fragmenting unnecessarily seems counter-productive to me.
>> 2. As already mentioned, most visitors will need to fly and the difference
>> between the cost of a flight to Budapest vs a cost of a flight to Dublin
>> for most candidates for either event will not be all that significant when
>> all costs for attending are added up.
>> 3. We may not have big sponsors, pots of cash to spare, or unlimited
>> organisational resources so combining the two venues would surely help
>> immensely in that regard. Economies of scale come into it as sponsors are
>> more likely to want to chip in if there's greater attendance at a single
>> event than two smaller ones.
>> 4. People are less likely to bother even registering (or getting expenses
>> approved) if, as many have already mentioned, the event is just a single
>> day and justifying the efforts/costs then becomes a real issue. I
>> understand that previously colocated events with ApacheCon haven't
>> actually resulted in many people going to both. Ilya has mentioned this as
>> well.
>> In addition to combining the two events, I think that it should be
>> relatively easy to have a single 'official' day that is well funded and
>> organised but have one (or even two) day events before or after the main
>> event that can be informally organised by the community. Call them
>> hackathons if you will but not necessarily dedicated to writing code -
>> perhaps conduct panel discussions around marketing, direction of the
>> project, different use-cases (or markets), and some coding as well. If
>> ShapeBlue were interested in doing some 'sample chapters' of their
>> training courses as well I'm sure that would go down well for those new to
>> ACS (perhaps the day before the main event). These additional days could
>> be done without any AV, catering, presents, sponsored evening events etc.
>> I'm quite sure most people wouldn't complain about buying their own
>> drinks/food.
>> As for a venue however, this is the hole in my argument. Is it safe to say
>> that there are enough ACS types in Dublin that something could be
>> organised? Would Paddy Power be able to supply meeting rooms for example?
>> Is there an academic community in Dublin that might be happy to assist
>> with these sorts of informal events? Even a hotel with a bar/restaurant
>> might be willing if we agreed to a minimum spend on food/drink and that
>> we'd put it as the top listed suggestion for where to stay when attending.
>> They might even give us a discount on rooms.
>> Obviously if it appears that we do have resources to improve these
>> additional informal days then great but in terms of commitment, we could
>> set a much lower requirement vs trying to run a full two or three-day
>> event. Doesn't mean that the event can't autoscale with demand!
>> How does that resound with everyone?
>> Adrian
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Arjan []
>> Sent: 06 March 2015 05:32
>> To:
>> Subject: Re: CloudStack Conferences
>> Price is mostly venue, catering, audio video, evening events. (Gifts)
>> Time is number of tracks, speakers, sponsors, look and feel.
>> So you can fiddle around with combinations. Two day low profile single
>> track could be easier than 1 day the whole shebang with party and speaker
>> dinner etc
>> Rgds,
>> Arjan
>>> On 5 mrt. 2015, at 23:56, ilya musayev <>
>> wrote:
>>> Arjan and Sebastian
>>> Thanks for sharing your experiences in setting up the conferences,
>>> Just curious would 2 day events be more justifiable, easier to organize
>> and also less expensive?
>>> Thanks
>>> ilya
>>>> On 3/5/15 2:39 PM, Arjan wrote:
>>>> Thanks Seb,
>>>> I agree. We wanted to organize ccceu14 again, but the effort on
>> organizing another 3 day event was too big. Next to that for Amsterdam we
>> have put in serious money together with Citrix.
>>>> So 3 day events work, but you need time and / or funds.
>>>> A one day event is much easier. Single track. Smaller location etc etc.
>>>> I am in favor of the hybrid approach though, but most likely the 1 day
>> events will happen more. Maybe it is even an option to do the devops days
>> approach. Every city can organize one as a sort of franchise model.
>>>> Arjan
>>>>> On 5 mrt. 2015, at 10:00, Sebastien Goasguen <>
>>>>> Morning folks,
>>>>> This is a good point, however like Chip mentioned we would need
>> sponsors.
>>>>> Organizing a 3 day event is a big task, you need to find a location
>> that suits people, you need to pay for that location, you need a program,
>> you need attendance, you need sponsors etc.
>>>>> For Amsterdam, Schuberg took the lead role. Citrix was the main
>> financial backer with Schuberg. I believe it basically took ~3 people full
>> time from Schuberg for several months to organize things the way it was,
>> plus a lot of time and energy from other folks to get sponsors, drive
>> attendance etc. The event cost ~200k euros and was in the black at the end
>> (no secret there).
>>>>> For Denver and Budapest we aligned with the ASF and leveraged the
>> Linux Foundation to do the logistics and help get sponsors. It worked out
>> but it is still a lot of effort to get the program together, help LF reach
>> out to sponsors etc. As a side note, even though these were 3 day events,
>> lots of folks arrive on tutorial day, spend the keynote day and leave at
>> night or in the morning. That's why I pushed for a poster session at the
>> end of Budapest, because typically folks leave before and we end up with
>> semi empty sessions in the last afternoon.
>>>>> The bottom line is that it is a question of cost, attendance, who
>> takes the lead in planning and what does the event look like. We could
>> organize three day events much cheaply. Something that comes to mind is
>> configuration management camp in Ghent. It drives 400 people, is hosted at
>> the university. There is almost no sponsors/booth, no signage, no video
>> recording, very little lunch etc. But if we want something like Denver or
>> Budapest, we are looking at 6 figures plus the human investment.
>>>>> CloudStack is a brand owned by this community, so anyone here is free
>> and should feel entitled to organize its own CloudStack Day close to home.
>> Norway, India etc. It could be a 30 people event or it could grow into its
>> own 300/500 people event. The Japanese community for example organizes
>> CloudStack Japan on their own and drives 500 people.
>>>>> Now all these 1 day events are co-located (before, after or during)
>> the linuxcon events (cloud open, KVM forum, Xen summit, Kernel summit
>> etc). So I am sure you can justify going for 3 days, attend the other LF
>> events and attend the CloudStack day. I do think there is better alignment
>> with LF events than with other ASF projects. Sadly the Apachecon itself is
>> not a large conference, and I don't think we got the cross-pollination we
>> were hoping. LF events are much bigger (Dusseldorf in the fall was 1,500
>> people).
>>>>> The risk I do see with 1 day event is that we get fragmented and that
>> we don't see each other that often.
>>>>> To conclude, it is key that everyone on our lists feels entitled to do
>> things and take the lead. In some sense there is no such thing as us vs.
>> "the organizers". We are all the organizers of these conferences. It is a
>> matter of who has the time and the will to step up and lead these events
>> (1 or 3 days ) and who will attend.
>>>>> -If you have the time, can you take the lead and organize another 1
>> day event closer to home ?
>>>>> -If you have time, can you take the lead on one of those scheduled
>> events and take on the program planning ?
>>>>> -If you have funds, can you sponsor the event ?
>>>>> -if you have space, can you donate it for an event ?
>>>>> -sebastien
>>>>>> On Mar 5, 2015, at 2:01 AM, Erik Weber <>
>>>>>> On Thu, Mar 5, 2015 at 3:45 AM, ilya musayev
>> <> wrote:
>>>>>> Am i right in assuming that we no longer going to have 3 day long
>> conferences and instead 5 separate cloudstack day events? It does makes
>> sense as it helps with awareness, but..
>>>>>> Looking at it from my employers side, as well as my personally -
>> a bit hard to justify a trip for just one day :( On average, a person
>> would have to travel a night before and leave a day later to make the most
>> of it. That is 2 days spent in transit to attend 1 day event.
>>>>>> Lets see how this works out, but i really think we need at least
>> event that is longer than a day - so we can have a community get together
>> that many would be able to attend.
>>>>>> I must agree.
>>>>>> Unless you live near one of the airline hubs you'll most likely have
>> to travel three days anyway.
>>>>>> In my case I have to travel the night before to get there before
>> and as anyone would want to attend the night events (that's usually where
>> I personally get most out of the conference) I have stay a night longer.
>>>>>> Justifying a three day trip to attend a one day event is
>> significantly harder than justifying a four day (we usually arrive a bit
>> later on the first day) trip to attend a three day event.
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Erik

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